Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything

[Crisp Image]

Thanks Chris.
 I have now set that and got rid of the warning and RSSI indictor onscreen.
I managed to have a flight today that lasted for 8 min.
First of all I did not crash! That is a bonus. As far as flying this FC and the KK this one is so much better in stab mode than the KK in Self level.
I tried out Alt Hold and it worked quite well. The slight breeze pushed it around a little but that is to be expected. The rest of it went well with the quad holding Alt while being flown around.
Next on the list was Loiter. Well when I switched it to Loiter I expected it to stay where it was. It took off first to the right and pitched forward after about 4 seconds of this (seemed like a long time) and remembering that Chris had had something like this happen to him I could not let it go any longer so switched back to Stab and regained control.
reviewing the logs I had 8-10 sats at all times and started off with HDop of 1.73 and got down to 1.61 so that is fine.
I tried RTL and it took off like Loiter which suggests there is something to do with the GPS.
I managed to recover the quad every time and landed safely.
I was using Droid planner with the telemetry radio which was quite good and also the OSD on the FPV Ground station.
The OSD dropped out for some reason and I have noticed it do that on the odd occasion. A push of the rest button usually gets it back but I cant do that when flying.
The FPV camera lens came loose so the image was out of focus. Bluetac fixed that.
So my only real problem ATM is the loiter and RTL (anything that uses the GPS) doesn't seem to be working the way it should.
Just as I picked the quad up it started spitting rain and now the breeze is getting stronger.
Any suggestions?

Crispy

[Mandrake]

Got this today so should be able to set up the OSD screen in English tonight...Still too windy down here to fly...

[CBRK]

Well I've managed to resurrect a dead GPS!!!!

It had two repairs that needed to be done, grrrr.

The first was the GPS antenna needed to be replaced.  Crispy if you PM your address I'll send you a new antenna so you can fix yours.  Note there is no solder holding the Antenna in place to the chip, it's just a tight fit (so just slide a knife between the board and the antenna and it should come out).  I did have to trim the length of the new pin to fit into the antenna port on the board.  I took some video of this part so I'll try to post it up soon.

The second fix was to do with the connector, something happened to it in the crash as not all the seemed to be hooked up on a resistance test.  So off it came and I soldered a new DF13 socket in place (damn thats hard work, those are some small pins).

I now have the GPS connected to an APM board and it is showing a GPS lock with 7 sats and a HDOP around 3 - it is under cover so I'm hoping when outdoors this will drop a bit lower.

Currently installing all the software I need onto the little ODROID C1.  Having to compile some stuff as it's an ARM based processor so most APM things are compiled for intel based chips.

Tomorrow I'm going to try to resurrect one of my broken minim's and get the gimbal mount ready for the new parts that will turn it into a 3 axis gimbal.

I'm thinking of using a CNC cutting place to do some carbon fibre plates for the tricopter, it might help to lighten it's weight.  Does anyone know any places in Aus which are reasonably priced and good quality?  I' thinking of using http://www.cutfromcad.com/

Chris

[Crisp Image]

I have had some success this afternoon!
Compass offsets are
COMPASS_OFS_X   -94
COMPASS_OFS_Y   43
COMPASS_OFS_Z   25
and I am using the external compass as well.
It seems all the pictures I saw with the compass plugged in near where the power goes were incorrect.
Trawling the forums for answers RC groups came up with the goods.
Everything compass and GPS is good now according to MP. Now I need to try in the real world which wont happen for a few days at least cause I am back at work for the next 2 days (12 hr shifts) so Sunday it might be if the wind doesn't come up.
I am not really worried about the wind normally but when trying out new toys it is easier without it.

Chris I'll PM you the address when I have finished here. Would be good to have a spare in case of breakage again.

The moons seem to be coming into line. Lets hope they continue.

Regards
Crispy

[CBRK]

Thanks Chris.
 I have now set that and got rid of the warning and RSSI indictor onscreen.
I managed to have a flight today that lasted for 8 min.
First of all I did not crash! That is a bonus. As far as flying this FC and the KK this one is so much better in stab mode than the KK in Self level.
I tried out Alt Hold and it worked quite well. The slight breeze pushed it around a little but that is to be expected. The rest of it went well with the quad holding Alt while being flown around.
Next on the list was Loiter. Well when I switched it to Loiter I expected it to stay where it was. It took off first to the right and pitched forward after about 4 seconds of this (seemed like a long time) and remembering that Chris had had something like this happen to him I could not let it go any longer so switched back to Stab and regained control.
reviewing the logs I had 8-10 sats at all times and started off with HDop of 1.73 and got down to 1.61 so that is fine.
I tried RTL and it took off like Loiter which suggests there is something to do with the GPS.
I managed to recover the quad every time and landed safely.
I was using Droid planner with the telemetry radio which was quite good and also the OSD on the FPV Ground station.
The OSD dropped out for some reason and I have noticed it do that on the odd occasion. A push of the rest button usually gets it back but I cant do that when flying.
The FPV camera lens came loose so the image was out of focus. Bluetac fixed that.
So my only real problem ATM is the loiter and RTL (anything that uses the GPS) doesn't seem to be working the way it should.
Just as I picked the quad up it started spitting rain and now the breeze is getting stronger.
Any suggestions?

Crispy

Hi Crispy,

Thats great news on the flying.

On the loiter and RTH, how have you mounted the APM?  Some have reported vibrations have caused issues, can you turn your logs on to nearly all and post up the dataflash log?  I can then see if its the same as mine was.

For mine I just left it a bit longer and it seemed to settle down, but it was seriously off track at first, it was around 6-8m away from where it should have been.  It stayed in the new home.

Note that when I was in Abercrombie River NP it seemed to work straight off the bat, no issues at all.  It stayed where I asked it to loiter to.  I only used loiter for 2 or 3 mins though.

On the MinimOSD mine has only failed occasionly and it's only the 12V non converted one that has done it.  It has only done it on the ground and it's usually within 20 seconds of it booting.  Reset works for me too.  I suggest checking all the connections, in particular the telemetry line.  The 12V will be converted to 5V shortly and I havent noticed it happening on that one, so it might be heat related?

Oh my GPS fix is now down to a HDOP of 2.4 and dropping so pretty good so far (note its still under a balcony roof)

Chris

[Crisp Image]

I think my problems stemmed from the compass telling the FC to do one thing and the GPS saying do another so I hope to have that sorted now.
When I fly next I will be able to test it.
Regards
Crispy


Sent using fat fingers on the iPad thingy

[CBRK]

Well my Pixhawk has arrived, so I plan to play a bit with that tonight.  I opened the package and the first surprise is that instead of the Neo-7N they decided to give me a M8N GPS instead, so very impressed by that.  Thank you goodluckbuy, extremely impressed.  So now I will hook up both a Neo-7N and a M8N GPS to the pixhawk, so should have very good GPS capabilities!

I also ordered a bunch of FR4 sheets and some carbon fibre square tubes.  I've decided my Tricopter needs a diet to fit all the extra goodies on it, but I would like to make it look more professional (and hide some cabling) and I figured that since all my photography on it will be on the stabilised gimbal I wont need to worry so much about vibration elimination (will still need to vib proof the pixhawk) which is why I was using wood.

I've put my plans on hold to modify the wooden frame to take the 3rd axis, I'll wait until I have the FR4 and carbon tubes (should be next week).

So to cut the FR4 fibreglass I've picked up a tungsten carbide jigsaw blade and plan to do it outside with a P2 and safety glasses.  Same with the CF tubes I've ordered.  I'll use my drill press to do the drilling.  I've still got to check what sand paper I have, I may need to get some 120 and 240 grit wet and dry to finish the edges off (I think i have some of that in a pile downstairs....)

I've been working on the ODROID C1 and I've got MAVProxy installed and working.  I'm trying to get APM Planner 2 built and running on it too.  Having less luck with it so far.  I have to be careful it appears if I do a kernel update it stuffs the image up.... Sigh.....  Tonight I'll do the connecting cable between it and the APM / Pixhawk and see how it goes.  If all goes well I'll be able to issue commands to it, I should also be able to connect my PC to the ODROID via wifi and be able to connect Mission Planner.

Chris

[Marschy]

Fun and games Chris,

I'd love to get a pixhawk.

I am having trouble at the moment with my X-mode Alien, while setting the gains in Acro mode, the throttle would go full bore all by itself when the throttle got to about 75%. I suspect it may be the cheapo HK ESC's that I flashed with Simonk going out of sync. I'm going to order some new Emax 30A BLHeli ESC's and see how they go.

I received the Emax 2206 1500kv motors in the post today from the emaxmodel web site. They stuffed up the order by sending the wrong ESC's. I ordered 20A, they sent 12A. They have given me a $2US credit on my next order which is more than the difference in cost, so I'm happy with that.

I am going to throw the 12A ESC's on the thrust tester and see what current they pull with 7 inch props on the 1500 kv motors. They are rated for 8-9 inch props, so I suspect the 7 inch prop may overload the ESC. I'm about to find out as soon as I solder on some bullet connectors.

[Mandrake]

Think I know what's wrong with my throttle problem --- I switched back to the Devo 7 Tx / Rx today and no problems --

So I've obviously done something stupid in the switch settings in the Radiolink Tx ...

I've also switched off the low voltage alarms as they were coming on WAY before the set voltages .. Just have to keep an eye on the OSD now ...

So here I are in Windyvale waiting for the calm air so I can test my theories ......

If this doesn't work I might have to kill the Alien and stick with the Phantom for my videos ... Just need to put FPV and OSD under the hood ..

Might have to go back to building wooden boats ... 2 dimension travel is much safer  ...

[Crisp Image]

Here you can see my connection with the compass on the side under the GPS port.
The jumper has been removed to enable the use of the external compass.
I have now the offsets that I posted before and the compass direction shows accurately on mission planner.
It seems the photo on HK is not correct with having the jumper on the other pins for external compass.
I had to trim the case a little to get the compass connection in but now it is all good.
Like I said before I got the answers from RCG and have had a couple of private messages from one member in particular.
So if anyone had the jumper on the other pins you can remove it as it does nothing at all.
Regards
Crispy


Sent using fat fingers on the iPad thingy

[Crisp Image]

If this doesn't work I might have to kill the Alien and stick with the Phantom for my videos ... Just need to put FPV and OSD under the hood ..

Might have to go back to building wooden boats ... 2 dimension travel is much safer  ...

First of all if you ditch the alien I might be interested in it.
Boats might be safer but maybe not as much fun!

Crispy


Sent using fat fingers on the iPad thingy

[Marschy]

I received the Emax 2206 1500kv motors in the mail today for my Trifecta tri-copter. I ordered 20A BLHeli ESC's, but received 12A BLHeli ESC's. emaxmodel have offered me a store credit for the difference in cost, so I'm happy with the outcome.



I threw a 6x4 APC prop on and the ESC's weren't overworked, but the thrust was not ideal either. 372 grams @ 6.9A.



Next I threw a 7x5 APC prop on, much better result, but the ESC is now pushed to its constant current limit of 12A, 535 grams @11.9A.



This will be more than enough for my purposes. If need be I'll look at the funcolor 15A BLHeli ESC's with some Gemfan 8x3.8 props which will supposedly give me around 630 grams @ 15.2A.

[CBRK]

Here you can see my connection with the compass on the side under the GPS port.
The jumper has been removed to enable the use of the external compass.
I have now the offsets that I posted before and the compass direction shows accurately on mission planner.
It seems the photo on HK is not correct with having the jumper on the other pins for external compass.
I had to trim the case a little to get the compass connection in but now it is all good.
Like I said before I got the answers from RCG and have had a couple of private messages from one member in particular.
So if anyone had the jumper on the other pins you can remove it as it does nothing at all.
Regards
Crispy


Sent using fat fingers on the iPad thingy

Apologies I thought you had done that already?  There are notes on the HK site that say that they moved the compass port to be next to the GPS port for the 2.7.

I agree the pics they have arent good as they are for a 2.5/2.6 board.  I may have lead you astray in an earlier post, I think it was before I realised you were using a 2.7 and I completely forgot about it.

I just did a look back over the pics you posted, i can see where you have it plugged in on a post way back.  Great news that you've got it working well :-)

Chris

[CBRK]

I received the Emax 2206 1500kv motors in the mail today for my Trifecta tri-copter. I ordered 20A BLHeli ESC's, but received 12A BLHeli ESC's. emaxmodel have offered me a store credit for the difference in cost, so I'm happy with the outcome.



I threw a 6x4 APC prop on and the ESC's weren't overworked, but the thrust was not ideal either. 372 grams @ 6.9A.



Next I threw a 7x5 APC prop on, much better result, but the ESC is now pushed to its constant current limit of 12A, 535 grams @11.9A.



This will be more than enough for my purposes. If need be I'll look at the funcolor 15A BLHeli ESC's with some Gemfan 8x3.8 props which will supposedly give me around 630 grams @ 15.2A.

Since the mini tri is so small you won't be carrying much weight on it, do you need the addition 100g x 3 of thrust?  I'd stick with the combo you have, the AUW should be less than 600-700g giving you plenty of wriggle room.

I'd give it a go with the combo you have now and work out if you need the 15A ESC's.  Otherwise where are your 12A ESC's going to go?

Chris

[Marschy]

Yeah, I agree, it should be ample. I may still get the 15A ESC's, the 12's get very warm just on the thrust tester.

[CBRK]

Well I've done a quick stock take and I'm happy that I wont have to take the Tricopter out of commission until the new frame is built.  I have enough spare ESC's to build up the new frame, I can make a new tilt mechanism, I have the pixhawk, spare GPS's, spare GPS mounts, and some spare motors.  Only bit I don't have enough spares of are the motors, I only have 2 spares so once I'm happy i've got it well built I'll move the motors across.  I would have had enough if I hadn't broken one of the before.....

I was bad and ordered some CF sheets, I'm trying to work out if I build the new plates using CF or FR4.  CF will mean potential RF interference but will be lighter.  The FR4 should be more flexible so less prone to breaking.  Decisions, decisions, I have till next weeks arrivals to decide.  Both the FR4 and CF (Woven Pattern) are 1.5mm thickness (I also picked up a CF 1mm sheet too but not for the main plates - they are for various items).  Both are difficult to work with and have similar safety issues.  I will have to paint the FR4 black if I use it as I want a more professional looking tricopter.

So questions I have are:
1. Who has primarily CF frames and have they found any RF issues?
2. Has anyone had to cut CF or FR4 themselves, what did they use - I'm planning on using a tungsten carbide jigsaw blade and sand it back if required with a dremel and sanding block.

Chris

[CBRK]

Yeah, I agree, it should be ample. I may still get the 15A ESC's, the 12's get very warm just on the thrust tester.

Hi Mark,

You'll spend the majority of the time at 50-70% throttle and they should get good airflow from the props.  If they are getting hot hot at 70% throttle and in the air flow of the prop then yeah I'd go up a size too.

Chris

[Marschy]

Where did you get the carbon fibre sheets from Chris. I use fibre glass power circuit board quite often for making mounting plates, like I have here with the mini quad, but either plain fibre glass or carbon fibre would be better. I give them a lick of black spray paint, they come out quite well.

I cut mine out by printing an outline on the printer, paste to the fibre glass sheet, remove the bulk of the excess on my disk sander, then use a saw sharpening file (triangle shaped) for getting into fiddly spots.

[CBRK]

Just uploaded two videos to my YT channel from the recent trip to Abercrombie River NP.  Just working on the third video, should be up in the next few hours.

All three are of the Silent Creek Campground, the first two are more of the actual campground, the third is a view of the surrounding terrain.  Unfortunately I couldn't get the tricopter up for more than 10 seconds on the hill I wanted to go up from and the footage isn't good enough to put up.

Channel is: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYFUqy_lwTRdQLjS0ZBkHNw

[Marschy]

Hi Mark,

You'll spend the majority of the time at 50-70% throttle and they should get good airflow from the props.  If they are getting hot hot at 70% throttle and in the air flow of the prop then yeah I'd go up a size too.

Chris

You are absolutely right. I'm gunna wait and see how the 12's go. People report the Emax being good for bursts up to 18A. They are a great little ESC.

[Marschy]

Just uploaded two videos to my YT channel from the recent trip to Abercrombie River NP.  Just working on the third video, should be up in the next few hours.

All three are of the Silent Creek Campground, the first two are more of the actual campground, the third is a view of the surrounding terrain.  Unfortunately I couldn't get the tricopter up for more than 10 seconds on the hill I wanted to go up from and the footage isn't good enough to put up.

Channel is: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYFUqy_lwTRdQLjS0ZBkHNw

Watching now, very jealous.

Love it when you can see the shadow of the tri on the ground. You are getting very accomplished at this flying gig Chris.

[CBRK]

Where did you get the carbon fibre sheets from Chris. I use fibre glass power circuit board quite often for making mounting plates, like I have here with the mini quad, but either plain fibre glass or carbon fibre would be better. I give them a lick of black spray paint, they come out quite well.

I cut mine out by printing an outline on the printer, paste to the fibre glass sheet, remove the bulk of the excess on my disk sander, then use a saw sharpening file (triangle shaped) for getting into fiddly spots.

I noticed that HK Aus had some CF sheets in so I thought why not.  Seems they are actual CF and not FR4 laminated in CF.  Seems to be getting reasonable reviews from it too.  Good thing is these are the woven style so good strength in all directions.

I was thinking of doing the print and stick onto the CF, what do you stick it down with?.  Do you do the score and snap method first to get it roughly the right shape?  Then disk sand it down?  I was thinking of picking up a fine small square file and round file, I have both already but they are bastard cut for wood working so I doubt they will agree with the CF.

Chris

[CBRK]

Watching now, very jealous.

One of us had to get out and about and do some AP 

The third video according to YT will be up in about 30 mins time.  Damn it takes a long time to upload videos.

There is still a slight yaw wobble that the 3rd axis gimbal will remove.

Chris

[Marschy]

I noticed that HK Aus had some CF sheets in so I thought why not.  Seems they are actual CF and not FR4 laminated in CF.  Seems to be getting reasonable reviews from it too.  Good thing is these are the woven style so good strength in all directions.

I was thinking of doing the print and stick onto the CF, what do you stick it down with?.  Do you do the score and snap method first to get it roughly the right shape?  Then disk sand it down?  I was thinking of picking up a fine small square file and round file, I have both already but they are bastard cut for wood working so I doubt they will agree with the CF.

Chris

I use fine tooth metal files, like the saw sharpening file I mentioned earlier, they take the fibre glass away reasonably easily and do a nice job on the edge. They should be suitable for carbon fibre as well, but the carbon fibre will blunt files and drills pretty quickly.

I just cut out what I need with a hacksaw. I was thinking of getting a set of needle files, but what I have does 95% of what I need to do, and needle files are bloody expensive.  I have a fine flat file and rectangular saw sharpener. If you can, get a flat file with one of the narrow edges with a flat surface.

Here are some leg extensions I made for the Trifecta tri-copter from a printout of a dxf file from a guy who designed them on rcgroups.

[Marschy]

what do you stick it down with?

I've been glueing it down with thick CA on the copper, then I sand it off before etching it. But I have also used a glue stick as well. You can use your heat gun to speed up the drying. The glue stick also works well.

I also use the same method for making brackets. Print, paste, cutout, drill, file. The results aren't 100%, but with a lick of spray paint, they pass muster.