Where to buy weapons?

[terravista]

I do not have any moral concerns in using rifles or killing animals that are pests, I have received my firearms license and need to fill some blank spots in the gun safe.
The need for weapons is for a 146 acre farm that my daughter will be breeding horses on. There is a pack of 6 feral dogs and at least one family of pigs and both groups are capable of doing damage to the horses. and the rabbits do make nice stew.
After a heap of research it looks like a .22LR, 12 gauge shotgun and a .223 are the "go to" weapons in cases like this.
These are expected to be used infrequently so hi-tech, high priced, and being fitted with all the bells and whistles is not needed, and I am willing to get used weapons or the more basic brands of new. Apparently Northern Europe have manufacturers of half decent quality sold via gun shops.
The .22 is sourced but the other two not.
What is the best places to buy these? There is an abundance of on-line websites and the old "physical" gun shops. Either way, test shooting does not look like an option.
Is buying via web sites a trap or a viable method of purchase?
Does anyone have any suggestions on reputable websites?
A crap load of years in the Army gave me no knowledge on shotguns. F1's, M60's, SLR's, Carl Gustav's etc fine, but no shotguns, so I need educating in chokes. Does a 3/4 choke sound right for pigs and dogs, and what cartridges would you recommend?
Thanks
Ian

[edz]

Google,  Brisbane gun shops ...
 Take your pick and visit to see who your most comfortable with "  Keep in mind  used car salesman  " Some are no different ..
Do your Research as to the condition of used fire arms and the $$ for the types in used / new condition and go from there ..

[tryagain]

Never used them but I hear https://www.cleaverfirearms.com/ often have very good prices.

[chester ver2.0]

I do not have any moral concerns in using rifles or killing animals that are pests, I have received my firearms license and need to fill some blank spots in the gun safe.
The need for weapons is for a 146 acre farm that my daughter will be breeding horses on. There is a pack of 6 feral dogs and at least one family of pigs and both groups are capable of doing damage to the horses. and the rabbits do make nice stew.
After a heap of research it looks like a .22LR, 12 gauge shotgun and a .223 are the "go to" weapons in cases like this.
These are expected to be used infrequently so hi-tech, high priced, and being fitted with all the bells and whistles is not needed, and I am willing to get used weapons or the more basic brands of new. Apparently Northern Europe have manufacturers of half decent quality sold via gun shops.
The .22 is sourced but the other two not.
What is the best places to buy these? There is an abundance of on-line websites and the old "physical" gun shops. Either way, test shooting does not look like an option.
Is buying via web sites a trap or a viable method of purchase?
Does anyone have any suggestions on reputable websites?
A crap load of years in the Army gave me no knowledge on shotguns. F1's, M60's, SLR's, Carl Gustav's etc fine, but no shotguns, so I need educating in chokes. Does a 3/4 choke sound right for pigs and dogs, and what cartridges would you recommend?
Thanks
Ian

For pigs it depends on the terrain. If it is thick bush you are better off going a solid slug as the pellets will be scattered by the foalage with only 1 or 2 hitting the animal.

If it is wide open terrain i usually used a rifle with a bit of grunt as the bastards would do the bolt before you got into shot gun range.

You could use dogs but once you go down that path it will make your gun cabinet look like a cheap investment compared to keeping those 4 legged friends health and happy

[plusnq]

You could use dogs but once you go down that path it will make your gun cabinet look like a cheap investment compared to keeping those 4 legged friends health and happy

Yes. No one ever called the RSPCA about a dirty rifle either 😂

[wetduck]

website https://www.usedguns.com.au/

this site allows sellers to advertise. You contact seller to negotiate.

Qld Gun Exchange is a large shop in East Brisbane.

For a low cost farm shotgun, a single barrel 12 guage without choke is heaps. May be a .410 or 20 guage is better suited to a female. The latter are great snake guns.

[terravista]

For a low cost farm shotgun, a single barrel 12 guage without choke is heaps. May be a .410 or 20 guage is better suited to a female. The latter are great snake guns.

She had a go with a .410 and a 12 gauge at the Gun Club Saturday and for the occasional shoot the 12 gauge would be fine.

As for getting dogs, that is not going to happen. Might be a different story if hunting was involved, but pest eradication does not justify them.
Cheers

[xcvator]

website https://www.usedguns.com.au/

this site allows sellers to advertise. You contact seller to negotiate.

Qld Gun Exchange is a large shop in East Brisbane.

For a low cost farm shotgun, a single barrel 12 guage without choke is heaps. May be a .410 or 20 guage is better suited to a female. The latter are great snake guns.

Not where pigs are concerned, the more fire power you've got the better. We used to hunt them out from Mildura years ago, and not 1 person took a single shot weapon of any sort, every thing was either pump or lever action.

[driordon]

Hi Terravista,

If you did not want to go down  the path of purchasing firearms and keeping them on the property, then the SSAA do a farmer assist program where you advertise that you have a pest problem (dogs and pigs), shooters that have completed the required checks and tests then offer to take on the job and you get to decide what member you would like to come out and remove the pest.

https://farmerassist.com.au

Good luck with it, wild dogs are becoming a huge problem.

Daniel

[tonywatto]

Give Guns n Ammo a go at Jimboomba. Gavin always has given me good advice and carry’s a good selection

[Craig Tomkinson]

Hi Ian, At one stage local councils were helping out rural block owners that had feral dog troubles, They would pay for A feral dog trapper to come out and trap the dogs with rubber jawed traps, I do not know if it is still available, could give your local council a ring, Craig   

[Red Dog 4x4]

I have used, both cleavers and On target fire arms both on the northisde of Brisbane, On target are one of the better ones for 1 on 1 for knowledge and are very help full, Cleavers are a bit funny unless your there to buy some thing they will ignore you ( staff of about 15-20 so not like they can miss you )

I would look at a .243 ( what the wife normally uses ) big enough for most dogs and pigs in the right spot, 12 gauge is a must, I would look at a adler or pradus leaver action. I would also consider a .223 if you feel the 243 to big, cheap inexpensive rounds.

I have been told a 270 is a good round to use as well but haven't shoot one my self. I use a 308, but the shoulder knows about it after about 50 rounds.

But all this aside, I am sure any one of us my swaggers would love to come out for a week or so to "help get rid of the problem"... 

Red Dog

[prodigyrf]

Bang for buck 12G it's hard to go past the Turkish Akkar Churchill and if you get the trap gun with various chokes you might enjoy DTL, Trench and Skeet shooting at a club-
https://www.gunemporium.com.au/view/1989
Mind you like golf clubs there are blokes who spend $35k AUD on a Perazzi-
http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/shotguns/perazzi-shotguns.cfm?cat_id=650

[paul.o]

Hi Ian,

Your choice of calibres is pretty good, but for the centrefire, whilst a .223 will do the job most of the time, I'd be leaning toward a .243 for the pigs and dogs. They'll do the same job but more effectively, particularly on a bigger animal. A .223 is ok if you're only spotlighting and/or you can get a shot at undisturbed game, but that's not always the case. Ammo and a good second hand rifle are generally easy to come by, and not too expensive. Recoil and noise is too bad either. As for brands, you're on the money with the European brands, but the Howa/CMC Mountaineer rifles are a good unit for the money also. A standard scope for such a rifle would be a 3-9 x 40 in a decent brand.


But any bolt action by a familiar brand would/should be fine.

As for you shotgun, don't buy a single barrel, it will kick like one of your daughters horses and wouldn't be pleasant to use. The same goes for most old side by sides as well.
 You might have to spend a bit extra, but a second hand Miroku under and over will be worth every cent. It will be comfortable to shoot, especially recoil wise, and it will never wear out. You can usually pick them up for around and even under $1000. There's one on Used Guns at the moment for $550, with the transferring dealer Queensland Gun Exchange.

 As for chokes, Half and Full or Three Quarter and Full are a common combination and would suit some pest eradication.


 For ammo, for the bunnies, size 4 shot in 32gram-1-1/8 oz. would go ok, and for the pigs and dogs, start at BB and go up, but as you go up in size, you go down in pellet count. BB's are a good compromise for hitting power and pattern density, 36gram- 1-1/4oz of shot here. And maybe a packet of 28 gram 9's for snakes if need be.

Good luck and have fun!

Paul

[terravista]

The times I have seen the pigs they are clean. No mud for armour plating. The locals are having no problems dropping pigs and dogs (so they claim) with a .223. The ammo is cheaper than .243 but not enough to justify not going a heavier round if necessary though.

[paul.o]

Yeah, a .223 would handle them most of the time, if not all  of the time.

But a .243 would handle them with a bit more room for error/ bit further away/ get a bigger animal. Particularly if you were aiming into the ribs rather than a head shot.

Either way, I'm sure you'll be fine.

Paul

[Fizzie]

Couple of questions that no-one seems to have asked yet TV

Is your daughter also in Qld

&, real stupid one, but you'd be amazed how often people say No , she does have her A/B licence, doesn't she

[Cruiser 105Tvan]

Terravista. 
Your gunna need storage for when your not there.
You might contact the Farmers Fed. people  to see if they have any recommendations.
If you go after the pigs with a shottie, you'll need to get close, even with a slug type Ammo.
If you use slugs, you'll need a cylinder bore that can be adapted with chokes for Birds and other disciplines.
You can buy the gear in the Valley near Brisbane CBD.  As mentioned earlier.
0.222 will shoot flatter than a 0.243 and better on dogs, foxes etc. and you'll still need a license, even if it's a primary producer/Farmer type one.
Might be an idea to get out to a rifle range for practice before you start with this.
There's a large Park, to the South of Brisbane, that caters for shotgun, rifle, Bow Hunters etc.
Get off at the Redland Bay/Capalabah  exit. (I think.)

[Paddler Ed]

Have a read of the QLD rules if you haven't - I'm not sure how you'd go getting the Primary Producer licence not living on the property in question (although QLD are a bit more sane on the PP rules than NSW are) so that might take a bit of working round.

I can't add any more to it, other than pigs are clever, and dogs are as well... you'll need a couple of strategies to get them... Also watch the dogs - that pack may be actually preventing another more destructive one moving in (this has happened before on properties, and whilst the old pack might have knocked a few old and sick things off, the new ones just killed anything...)

[terravista]

Couple of questions that no-one seems to have asked yet TV

Is your daughter also in Qld

&, real stupid one, but you'd be amazed how often people say No , she does have her A/B licence, doesn't she

Yep, daughter is in Qld. I have my A & B license and she has passed the Safety course and applied for the same. It takes 12 weeks to get the license and another 6 or so to get the first Permit To Aquire done.

I have no hesitation in buying and using the weapons, and storage is all legal with the appropriate bolted to wall gun safe.

The property fronts The Bruce Hwy and is surrounded by other smallish farms to 300 acres, and this appears to be the only dog pack. Neighbor's just shrug and say if you lose the occasional beast it is expected. I have a far different view.

I would prefer to do my own shooting than rely on others. I have a fair degree of confidence with a rifle. In the old Army days I qualified to represent the Army and shoot in England a couple of times, just couldn't be arsed enough to sit on a Hercules for 30 hours, hurt the ears for three days and fly back.

[terravista]

Have a read of the QLD rules if you haven't - I'm not sure how you'd go getting the Primary Producer licence not living on the property in question (although QLD are a bit more sane on the PP rules than NSW are) so that might take a bit of working round.

I can't add any more to it, other than pigs are clever, and dogs are as well... you'll need a couple of strategies to get them... Also watch the dogs - that pack may be actually preventing another more destructive one moving in (this has happened before on properties, and whilst the old pack might have knocked a few old and sick things off, the new ones just killed anything...)

I looked at the Primary Producers requirements and went with the sporting side of things getting a written approval from the property owner to shoot there. My daughter needed to give herself approval to shoot on her land as she is not registered as a Primary Producer.
Cheers

[edz]

For me I would also be looking at a shorter Carbine style barrel length rifle, as you would know much easier to handle and get on target + easier to move around in the scrub with and still good to the most used effective ranges . No need for Heavy long barrel target shooting type rifles .

[wetduck]

For me I would also be looking at a shorter Carbine style barrel length rifle, as you would know much easier to handle and get on target + easier to move around in the scrub with and still good to the most used effective ranges . No need for Heavy long barrel target shooting type rifles .

a lot easier to shoot with from within a car also. Getting on target and shooting quickly is the most important aspect when targeting ferals. On 146 acres, after a first shot miss, the dog or pig and its mates will soon be in the neighbour's.

I get the odd dog and pig here at home 170acres and at the cattle block 300acres but taking a rifle out of the safe, loading up and carrying a rifle on the dash all of the
time gets old real quick.

[DrewXT]

Safer to refer to them as a firearm then a weapon.  Has a massively different connotation when getting a gun license...

When on the farm I used to use a .303 when shooting pigs, and my every day farm rifle was a .223 ... I found that a .223 didn't always put a pig down, and they get massively pissed off when not killed first time.



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[terravista]

Safer to refer to them as a firearm then a weapon.  Has a massively different connotation when getting a gun license...
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 Thanks, but I already have a license so I think weapon works damn fine.

Wikipedia Weapon: "A weapon, arm, or armament is any device used with intent to inflict damage or harm to living beings, structures, or systems. Weapons are used to increase the efficacy and efficiency of activities such as hunting, crime, law enforcement, self-defense, and warfare. In a broader context, weapons may be construed to include anything used to gain a strategic, material or mental advantage over an adversary.


Wikipedia firearm:
The first primitive firearms originated in 10th-century China when bamboo tubes containing gunpowder and pellet projectiles was mounted on spears into the one-person-portable fire lance,[5], which was later used to good effect in the Siege of De'an. In 13th century, "

Now that would piss off any self respecting pig.
Cheers