Opinions on Complete Campsite v. Kimberly Kamper v Aussie Swag

[Haylot]

Hello!

My hubby and I are currently planning a year long trip around the country (hopefully 2021) with our three children (who would be roughly 10, 8, 6 at the time of the trip).

We are thinking about upgrading our camper (we currently have a MDC Step Through so any of the above would be a pretty serious upgrade) to facilitate such a trip.

Our current favourite is the Complete Campsite Fraser xte because of the storage capacity, layout and finish.

We thought we loved the Kimberly the best, but on viewing in person it seems like it would be a bit cramped in bad weather for the five of us. But there are options for air suspension which the others dont have.

We liked the Aussie Swag too, but we liked the layout for the kitchen the least.

Any thoughts on any of these campers? We are fairly green so any input at all would be welcome. (For example is the air suspension a thing that should make a serious difference in our decision making process?)

We would be towing with a 2015 Prado, so like the idea of getting a trailer which can be customed to follow the tracks of the car and where we can use the spares on whatever tyre we happen to have trouble with.

Thanks in advance!

[cheif carlos]

I would stick with coils stay away from airbags less to go wrong. most setups are fairly well balanced on coils. otherwise they are all overpriced by about 5k

Also look at the amount of water carried, we are about to go from 90lt with our camper to over 300lt for extended touring, but with most of that on the ute.

otherwise pack lightly you don't want to have to keep repacking every time you stop, you don't want to be climbing over gear all the time

[GBC]

You'll need to confirm a prado has the ability to tow a loaded Kimberley etc with their large down weight on the drawbar.

[MarkVS]

A couple of things...
All 3 are good brands. And there are others.
I suggest your worrying about the wrong things.
Air bags, wheels following car tracks, matching spares are the wrong things for you to be worrying about.
I think you need to be focusing on things like storage, functionality, kitchen layout, pantry room, setup and packup ease, room for the 3 kids beds, shower setup, internal layout, after sales service etc.

Hard floor campers are going through some big changes at the moment. Take your time and keep looking. Keep going to the camping shows, and keep using what you have to learn what you like/dis like. Talk to people who have done round Aus trips. (At the National meet recently, I met a couple, who with their kids, have done 2 around Aus trips. They have matching car/trailer wheels but never had a flat...ever...and they don't have air bags on their camper.)
Living in a camper for 12 months is a serious commitment and everyone's wants/needs are different.

Hope that helps.

Mark

[Rumpig]

Main things to consider would be....

- towball weight...KK is pretty heavy and I would sssume AS is the same being they are very similar in design. I've not looked at the CC myself, but I'd be getting real life figures from owners on all 3 to get a true comparison.

- sleeping area....are you planning on the kids sleeping on the hard floor or an extra room? We have 2 kids that sleep on the hard floor of our KK (14yr old is same size as an adult and a 10 yr old), they take up almost the entire floor just about which is fine for a weekend, not great for longer periods. The extra room on the back is great space wise but only good for 2 kids for extended time IMHO, unless they like a tight fit crammed in like sardines, so one would have to go on the hard floor. You need to look at what the other trailers have, i've not looked st their options to know if they are any better or not.

- storage....for long trips in our KK there is enough room to store clothes for 2 adults under the bed but not 4 people, our kids clothes go in the back of my 4wd in bags. Weekend trips away we fit everyone's clothes under the bed in the draw easily, but when you need enough clothes for an extended period and both hot and cold climates, you need to look at where they'll all go. Taie a good look at the 3 and realistically work out what can fit where.

- extra storage.... you'll likely need to pack 5 camp chairs and a table in somewhere, where will they go? Getting stuff off and packing back onto the roof rack of the vehicle becomes a pain to do, we have a table that slides under the bed draw (fits 4 people only) and I have a storage box I added to the top of the front boxes on our KK to take 4 chairs, a small ladder I use to put the awning up (makes life easier for the high middle section), and also has a levelling ramp in it. You need to consider where will that gear go in all the campers.  Where will the kids beds go?....mattresses and sleeping bags, pillows etc?

I probably come off sounding abit negative to the KK, but the trailer has been fantastic for our family of 4 the past 7 years we've had it. Owning one means I can give my true option of what they are like, but reckon AS would be identical as the 2 are very similar trailers, and no experience with a CC.
I'd suggest you work out one day what you think you'll take away with you on a year long trip for the family of 5 (you'll be surprised how much room 5 peoples clothes takes up for example), then try and work out where it'll go in the camper and vehicle. Having done a 6 week touring trip in a Landcruiser wagon, I'm happier these days I have a dual cab 79 series with a canopy on the back, because there's so much more room to put stuff in the back. Putting stuff on the roofrack each day gets old fast as it's time consuming tieing it down or strapping up the roofrack bag...sounds negative again I know, but having done this before I know I got sick of doing it, and just trying to give you things to think about.
Good luck with your decision, wish it was my family undertaking such a trip 

[Supersi]

I agree with Rumpig. Adding to that look at the load capacity of a Prado, it's around 660kg. Allow for the 5 people in the car, say 300kg, fuel 100kg, towball load 250kg (all 3 brands will be close to this weight) and you are at about GVM capacity without the vehicle having a GVM upgrade. And you haven't packed anything on the rooof or in the back (food,clothes etc), not to mention any accessories such as bull bars and 2nd battery.

Re the campers, we had an Aussie Swag Ultra D, loved it but not sure I could do 12months with 3 kids in it. I did see at the Sydney show the new AS Ultra Max, it has a lot more room and might be better suited.

Good luck!

[Two shoes]

Okay, agree with all of the above.  We are owners of a Aussie swag, and the previous one had the rear kids room, which we used once!  It tended to make the trailer long and not many sites were good for it, if you knew what I mean.  Interested in your comments re the kitchen... I do the cooking and I love it. By swinging around and attaching you open up the annex, and the stove can be left out for the whole time. Access to the fridge and pantry are not an issue.  We were advised against it as the cooking smells would get into the tent! Never been a problem.

The real issues will be space and weight, for food, clothes, water etc for four people is quite high!  Enjoy the search, that is what we loved the most!

[gronk]

I'm not sure I'd want to do a year in a hard floor with only 2 adults, let alone 3 extra kids.

We went around Australia in a soft floor ( only took us 8 weeks ) with 2 young kids, and I thought that was as small as I'd like to go, and even though packup time wasn't as fast ( approx 1 hr from waking up, brekkie and pulling out of the campground ) as a hard floor, you get used to it, and you get faster at it.

I personally would use a soft floor......but one that is fast to packup and has the room you need. Surprising how many campers take loads of time to setup and packup, where as, just one of many that come to mind, a Trackabout, is fairly painless in this regard !

[Jason B]

I agree with the comments above. We are on our second KK and I don’t believe a Prado without a GVM upgrade could legally tow one with 5 people on board. Its easy to exceed 300KG in down ball weight alone which is beyond the capability of a Prado and with gear accessories etc even if you could get the tow ball weight below the 250kg limit, the vehicles GVM would be exceeded. The Frazer is a nice unit and wider than a KK or AS however the basic storage, space and design are similar. As suggested I would be looking at a quality fast set up / fast pack up soft floor. My pick would be the Complete Campsite units with the walk way up front. Heaps of storage, quick and easy to use and great build quality.

Regards

Jas

[Rumpig]

Agree with gronk above... Clouty used to have a soft floor Trackabout, and I was surprised how quickly he would pack that thing up when we camped together. I didn't write it in my original reply, but I reckon a family of 5 on a 12 month trip would be better off with a quality soft floor over a hard floor. Normally I'm no fan of soft floors, but a family of 5 in a hard floor for a 12 month period didn't sound like fun to me, just not enough room.

[GeoffA]

For a trailer suited to 2 adults and 3 kids, forget hard floors and take a good look at TrakShak. The only practical option IMO....

[GeoffA]

.....We were advised against it as the cooking smells would get into the tent! Never been a problem.....

Agree. It's a non-issue.....

[Supersi]

Also look at the new Mountain Trail hard floor as a comparison to the other 3 you have listed.

[bully]

Oh well looks like GVM will stop you doing anything. Better off staying home and watching tv shows.

We have a KK and 3 kids and we wouldn't be able to do a trip for a year in it. Personally I wouldn't do a trip like that in a camper with 3 kids. I would be looking at a small van. Once kids are off our hands the cook and I will do a lap with our KK but setting up kids beds and packing up each day would just drive me nuts. I would want something with all beds set up. Anyway good luck with your purchase and I really envy you getting to do this trip with your family.

[Jason B]

For a trailer suited to 2 adults and 3 kids, forget hard floors and take a good look at TrakShak. The only practical option IMO....

I had a Trak Shak before my KK's, the kitchen arrangement is a major pain in the arse, having to bring gas bottles and water to it every time you want to use it and then having the fridges at the other end of the camper and having to dismantle the stone guard to access them . For an extended trip with lunches on the run etc they are horrendous.

The Trackabouts are also a great camper worth consideration. 

[GeoffA]

I had a Trak Shak before my KK's, the kitchen arrangement is a major pain in the arse, having to bring gas bottles and water to it every time you want to use it and then having the fridges at the other end of the camper and having to dismantle the stone guard to access them . For an extended trip with lunches on the run etc they are horrendous.

What's this about bringing gas bottles and water to the kitchen? We never moved either...
Lunches on the run being horrendous?? Don't agree with that at all...
Our fridge was in the car...
Perhaps we had a much smarter configuration....

Any hard floor camper would be a major PITA with 3 kids.

[Jason B]

What's this about bringing gas bottles and water to the kitchen? We never moved either...
Lunches on the run being horrendous?? Don't agree with that at all...
Our fridge was in the car...
Perhaps we had a much smarter configuration....

Any hard floor camper would be a major PITA with 3 kids.

Yes you are a smart a....... A Track shack as configured from standard has the fridges, two of them at one end and the kitchen at the other, to access one or the other you have to dismantle the stone guard. Gas is on holders at the side and water is supplied by a hand pump that needs the 20lt (suppled) jerrys brought to it as no water tank was offered standard) Then if you don’t want to cook inside you have to lift that lot off the tailgate. I am talking about a standard Track Shak set up not your modified conglomeration! Compared to the other soft floor options they don’t make much sense. Not to mention the crap Chinese build quality of the later ones.

At least you were smart enough to move onto a better camper...........

[GeoffA]

Yes you are a smart a....... A Track shack as configured from standard has the fridges, two of them at one end and the kitchen at the other....

Touchy, and yes, I am... ......not in 1997 they weren't....

Not going to bother responding to the rest. I could, but it's just not worth the effort.......

At least you were smart enough to move onto a better camper...........

Yep, and it's better than yours.... (see your earlier response ...)

We didn't need the 2 queen size beds when the kids got older.

 

[Jason B]

Touchy, and yes, I am... ......not in 1997 they weren't....

Not going to bother responding to the rest. I could, but it's just not worth the effort.......

Yep, and it's better than yours.... (see your earlier response ...)

We didn't need the 2 queen size beds when the kids got older.

 

I have been told the forum was going down hill, sad but you confirmed all i needed to know.

[GeoffA]

I have been told the forum was going down hill, sad but you confirmed all i needed to know.

Jason,

Well there's a positive response...

I made a what I thought was a reasonably relevant and constructive original post, which you chose to shoot down.
You then went on to take a personal swipe at me. That's fine, but IMO it's a bit rich grizzling if you get a bit of your own back.

Some people take things way too seriously....

 

[LisaMoose]

Hi Haylot,

First I must say I am very jealous of your plans.

Like others have said I am not sure that a hard floor rear fold is going to suit you for that length of trip with 3 kids. We have a Mountain Trail EDX which I think someone else mentioned you should look at. We have only had ours for a few months and we have 2 children aged 14 and 12 and a dog that usually travels with us (our 3rd child). We tow it with a 2016 Prado. It is perfect for us and we are very impressed with the build quality and support from the guys at MTC.

We looked at all those trailers when making our decision before deciding on the EDX. KK was too heavy on the ball, CC wasn't offering quick awning at that time (not sure if they are now), wasn't sold on kitchen layout in Aussie Swag.

FYI with the EDX:
- my 14 yr old sleeps in his own 3sec oztent, 12 year old sleeps on self inflatable across back on hard floor
- did a rough ball weight today with new scales 170kg with everything in it we take including full water tank. Only extra things to add is fire wood, extra clothes and loaded up fridge. We keep as much in it as possible to enable quick weekend getaways. We are getting air bag suspension fitted on the Prado in the next fortnight to compensate for some rear end sagging.
- the only things we carry in the prado is the 3 sec tent, dog crate and some extra pantry food. That would do us a 4-5 night trip.

Given the age of your children and having the 3rd, squeezing them all in would be tricky. The floor size in EDX is somewhere between KK and CC.

Set up is very quick with the touring (quick) awning but having said that friends of ours have a Mars soft floor and it really didn't take them that much longer.

If you're looking for an Aussie made soft floor with the same build quality i think CC still make them. Unfortunately MTC have just ceased production of their soft floor (Escalade) to make way for a hybrid van. Have a look at their Facebook site. They had one for sale recently as a runout.

It's a big decision laying out that amount of cash so really do your homework. What we realized that no matter what your budget there is no perfect set up. You have to compromise somewhere.

Good luck,

Lisa

[Haylot]

Thanks everyone for the detailed replies. We liked the CC because it's internal spaces (storage and hard floor) are quite a lot larger than the AS and KK. We looked at the Mountain Trail but it also looked quite small for us all. I do thinks it's probably worth a revisit though because it was along day and we only looked at it at the end.

Hubby is absolutely sold on a hardfloor because of the faster set up time. But I think we will look at soft floors a bit better than ours too.

We think it possible that our oldest could sleep in a quick pop up tent adjacent to the camper in some circumstances. But we would like them in an additional room most of the time. We do like the idea of being raised up off the ground in case of extended crappy weather. We could potentially fit a bunk and stretcher in the hardfloor section of the CC, but we definitely wouldn't want that to be the standard arrangement.

Good to get feedback on the towball weight. My understanding is that the newest design on the CC has a lower ball weight than the others with the kitchen placed behind the axle. But it seems we will need to do a bit more research on it.

And good to know re the suspension. Our car doesn't have air suspension so why would the trailer need it. Again more research is probably needed.

Re the tyres I feel like I would just travel happier knowing we could swap them out. Sounds like the perfect scenario never needing to use any!!

The longest trip we've done so far was 6 weeks, so a year is a big jump. I guess if we hate it we can just come back. 

[Never enough time]

Haylot
As with Lisa Moose I am jealous and or don't have your courage
We've had a KK for 9 years with now no kids, having earlier had a soft floor for 4 years with our three kids. We have a similar vehicle (Pajero)
No way I'd consider a month let alone a year with a KK (or AS) and 3 kids, has to be a large area soft floor for the extra space needed
I am not familiar with the CC

Yes soft floors take longer to pack up, but give the kids a role in the pack up, that will help, they normally appreciate the responsibility. Wear overalls when packing  soft floor up, keeps your clothes clean from they dirty-wet underfloor. Soft floors ought to have a lighter two weight.
IF you are not going to do anything more challenging on suspension than Cape York/ Strezleki/Birsdville track, a good soft floor will be adequate and be considerably lighter on your tow ball//lower GVM which is my second consideration after sleeping space.

I'm sure your Prado will cope with the weight, even if you go down the KK or AS route, just buy a decent sized space crate and put it on top of the KK/AS. Pack food and other heavier goods in that, assuming you have the strength to lift it onto the KK/AS. After all KK will carry a tinnie on top (maybe with heavier springs, ask KK if you need a spring upgrade, they are relatively cheap)
Regardless of CT chosen, consider a airbag upgrade for your Prado, we've had them installed for 3 years with lots of dirt road driving and they are worth it.
You may need to change your dampeners (shockies) though before you go

Our longest trip was 3 weeks with the KK through central Australia with 3 kids, 5 all up, but plenty of other long fortnight trips

[carlyle]

We have 3 kids similar age (9,6,3 at present) and currently have the CC Kakadu soft floor. We too looked at hard floors but there just wasn't enough room in them. This was pre the new CC XTE model which is definitely larger and we considered changing but reconsidered as I still don't think 3 kids in that tight area for that amount of time would be pleasant. We are also looking at doing a 9/12 mth lap in ours in a couple of years and think that besides a van the soft floor is the only other way with the extra size. We went against a van as we don't want to be limited by where we can go if we want to get offroad anywhere.

As far as setup/pack up the soft floors (if they have decent setups/few poles/ropes/pegs) don't actually take that long and we can setup as quick as most caravans for the basic setup. Where the time comes into it is putting together kids beds/bunks/mattresses, tables and chairs. If you didn't have the kids stuff to setup you could be setup in 15 mins tops, a little longer to pack up. On the way to the MySwaggers meet we actually did our first quick single night stop over (didn't unhitch, put up walls or ground mats etc) as we normally holiday extended (4 days plus) when we go somewhere. It wasn't too bad we were setup in under 30 mins and pack up the next day about an hour which included breakfast/kids toilet stops etc. I think over time you would definitely quicken up and get the kids involved as well.

We don't fully dismantle the kids bunks and throw them with their small mattresses on top of our bed before packing up. This definitely saves time and storage space.

Storage is going to be the biggest issue for the trip with 5 people on board. With the CC it has drawers for clothes but only 4 so there will always be an extra bag packed for clothing plus the drawers won't be large enough for an extended trip. This needs to be a consideration as with young kids the clothes get thrown all around the place and you waste 20mins each packup just sorting that out. There is a lot of storage in the walkway but once you throw in a chemical toilet, kids sleeping bags/pillows, table and chairs, solar panel and awning walls it is basically full. The other thing I would love on it would be somewhere that the weber is permanently mounted on a swing away type setup as packing it up/down each day I can see getting tiring.

We are currently looking at vehicle alternatives for storage rather than camper alternatives and currently use the full canopy of the BT50 when travelling, so looking more at dual cabs (79 series/cruiser conversions) with full canopies with drawers etc and focusing on finding camping equipment that saves space/weight and time.

The CC soft floor isn't exactly light weight either. The Prado will pull it but you will know its there. We have a Prado & a BT50 and even though the Prado is much more luxurious and has DVD player etc for the kids I haven't bothered putting a tow bar on it as I think it would struggle compared to the BT50.

We couldn't be happier with the CC trailer, construction and service it is a quality camper its more about shaking it down more and more to get the best setup for our needs with the view of long range touring. It will never be perfect there will always be a sacrifice somewhere.

Happy to discuss further if you wish just shoot me a PM or ask questions on this thread.

[Jason B]

Jason,

Well there's a positive response...

I made a what I thought was a reasonably relevant and constructive original post, which you chose to shoot down.
You then went on to take a personal swipe at me. That's fine, but IMO it's a bit rich grizzling if you get a bit of your own back.

Some people take things way too seriously....

 

A personal swipe at you? Hmm your memory is a bit twisted as it was you that stated you had a much better set up etc......I was referring to my experience with a standard Track Shak not a modified one. I agree you did take things the wrong way.  I had a different opinion to you whoopee! You are the one espousing the greatness of your camper and putting mine down if my memory serves. So yeah lighten up and don’t take things so seriously.