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Author Topic: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?  (Read 18932 times)

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Offline Redcherokee

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #50 on: October 12, 2016, 08:32:16 PM »
Except those two bags of cement are sitting in your roof rack affecting your centre of gravity and wind drag as well.  Sure, you could put them in the back of the truck, but even the slightest fume makes that a bad idea.

Long range tank is nice and low.

Having done one trip with a small tank and having to worry about distances and decant fuel,  it is a pain in the tail.  Big tank is much less worry, and I'm happy to pay for that.

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Offline jk

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #51 on: October 12, 2016, 08:44:21 PM »
I completely agree with the over the top price of long range tanks, but they pop up quite regulary on eBay and Gumtree. We got the 170l tank for our Cruiser for $225, and that's the only reason it's in the car now.
I couldn't bring myself to pay around $1000+ or more for something we'll only use once every couple of years !!  I think the purchase price is a major consideration !
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Offline Joff

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #52 on: October 12, 2016, 09:09:11 PM »
Quote from: IanS on October 12, 2016, 08:22:20 PM

If you need the extra capacity for remote area travel you are better off having the extra fuel in separate containers, much easier to keep track of how much you have left

Isnt that what fuel guages on the dashboard are for. ???

Bugger seperate containers. It's all under there nice and snug. I pump it in, press a button when one is empty and keep driving. For about 1800km  ;D  8)
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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #53 on: October 12, 2016, 09:44:38 PM »
Did someone say GVM??...... :o ;D
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Offline SimpleSi

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #54 on: October 13, 2016, 02:49:30 AM »
Interestingly (perhaps?), on the planes I fly, carrying an extra tonne of fuel on a 9hr flight costs an extra 250kg of fuel burn. However on a quick flight (1hr) the extra burn is only about 30kg.
To answer the OP, I'd imagine there's no specific point at which the extra fuel burn kicks in, it would be a linear cost of carrying that extra fuel (<1%?).
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Offline Joff

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #55 on: October 13, 2016, 06:54:40 AM »
Quote from: GeoffA on October 12, 2016, 09:44:38 PM
Did someone say GVM??...... :o ;D

What difference does it make where the fuel is to weight, aside from the tank itself, if you need 250ltrs to get somewhere
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Offline NewieCamper

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #56 on: October 13, 2016, 07:55:20 AM »
Quote from: Joff on October 12, 2016, 09:09:11 PM
Isnt that what fuel guages on the dashboard are for. ???

Bugger seperate containers. It's all under there nice and snug. I pump it in, press a button when one is empty and keep driving. For about 1800km  ;D  8)

Pretty sure I'm going to be stopping a few times to stretch the legs and refuel myself in 1800km, let alone stopping for kids. It makes a bit of sense if the fuel stops are few and far between, but for regular highway stuff a fuel stop is a reasonable opportunity to 'stop revive survive'. Jerry cans would be my option if we were going somewhere there wasn't fuel.
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Offline jw2170

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #57 on: October 13, 2016, 08:23:14 AM »
Quote
I would need McGirr's formula to work our whether I am ahead.
....you read it...LOL

two observations...

1. Did not take long for BEER to be entered into the equation...... :cup:

2. (alright, caravan,  I know...) when my parents did their lap many years ago with a Cruiser, Dad just went to the wreckers and bought a small petrol metal tank from a wrecked car and mounted that on the roof rack....Probably only 10 or so gallons at the time...less $$$.
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Offline jr

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #58 on: October 13, 2016, 08:28:11 AM »
Carrying more or adequate fuel allows more direct route and no diversions when you arent sure youll make it,
Plenty of stretches and times where fuel is 3 hrs apart.  Plety of small towns dont have fuel after 5 or 6pm, in addition some run out or have problems supplying it.
Can always be a way around it but not always time or freedom to leave or travel when you like
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Offline Footy Shorts Shane

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #59 on: October 13, 2016, 08:45:11 AM »
By juuuuust getting 300km to a tank, I'd love a long range tank, 4 even  ;D

But I'm too tight to buy one and after 300km in the crusty rusty Hilux, you want to stop and get out any way  :D
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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #60 on: October 13, 2016, 09:47:44 AM »
Quote from: Joff on October 13, 2016, 06:54:40 AM
What difference does it make where the fuel is to weight, aside from the tank itself, if you need 250ltrs to get somewhere

Did someone say "trailer"?
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Offline Paddler Ed

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #61 on: October 13, 2016, 10:31:11 AM »
Quote from: SimpleSi on October 13, 2016, 02:49:30 AM
Interestingly (perhaps?), on the planes I fly, carrying an extra tonne of fuel on a 9hr flight costs an extra 250kg of fuel burn. However on a quick flight (1hr) the extra burn is only about 30kg.
To answer the OP, I'd imagine there's no specific point at which the extra fuel burn kicks in, it would be a linear cost of carrying that extra fuel (<1%?).

That's in line with my thoughts - so I wonder how much difference carrying 750kg of extra fuel would make... how much extra kg of fuel burn would there be for that? In effect, 25% of that tonne is wiped out... On the short flight it's down to 3%, so hear nor there (that's a couple of extra bags really)

I am suspecting a linear/exponential relationship - just not sure which way yet.

I've got a quiet spell with work, so my head goes into overdrive with other thoughts that satisfy my intellectual curiosity... the other day I was behind a red P plater, and was working out how much time I'd save if I overtook them and got past them for the remaining 8km of 100kmh road into town... I worked it out to be about a minute, so decided it was worthless... and then there was a set of roadworks which really would have rendered it a worthless exercise. Does that make sense now as to where these ideas come from?!
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Offline NewieCamper

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #62 on: October 13, 2016, 10:57:45 AM »
So if you're bored today care to knock up a graph of where the break even point is for carrying fuel vs purchasing it at say 20c/l more in the outback? ;D
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Offline scblack

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #63 on: October 13, 2016, 11:23:05 AM »
Quote from: Paddler Ed on October 13, 2016, 10:31:11 AM
I've got a quiet spell with work, so my head goes into overdrive with other thoughts that satisfy my intellectual curiosity... the other day I was behind a red P plater, and was working out how much time I'd save if I overtook them and got past them for the remaining 8km of 100kmh road into town... I worked it out to be about a minute, so decided it was worthless... and then there was a set of roadworks which really would have rendered it a worthless exercise.
My workmate has a daughter who is on her P's. So restricted speed.

On a trip from Winston Hills Sydney to Nelson Bay her slow speed added just 12mins to the whole trip.

So overtaking someone for just another 5km/h is a pretty worthless exercise in reality. And then when you get to the end of a freeway and the next set of lights you sit next to each other anyway.

(Not that I ever overtake in such frivolous manner...) :angel:
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Offline Joff

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #64 on: October 13, 2016, 11:39:22 AM »
Quote from: GeoffA on October 13, 2016, 09:47:44 AM
Did someone say "trailer"?

Oh christ! now we have to have a trailer for our extra fuel hahaha. Can someone do the math on the break even point for towing a fuel trailer versus buying it at the bowser  ;D, I sure someone here has enough nerd time on their hands  :cheers:

Not all of us always have trailers in tow ya know.
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Offline Joff

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #65 on: October 13, 2016, 11:43:55 AM »
Quote from: Paddler Ed on October 13, 2016, 10:31:11 AM


I've got a quiet spell with work, so my head goes into overdrive with other thoughts that satisfy my intellectual curiosity... the other day I was behind a red P plater, and was working out how much time I'd save if I overtook them and got past them for the remaining 8km of 100kmh road into town... I worked it out to be about a minute, so decided it was worthless... and then there was a set of roadworks which really would have rendered it a worthless exercise. Does that make sense now as to where these ideas come from?!

Did you factor in the frustration of sitting behind a slow car?? I'll pass them with 2ks to go if it means I don't have to sit behind some peanut that can't carry a decent speed
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Offline Paddler Ed

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #66 on: October 13, 2016, 11:55:30 AM »
Quote from: Joff on October 13, 2016, 11:43:55 AM
Did you factor in the frustration of sitting behind a slow car?? I'll pass them with 2ks to go if it means I don't have to sit behind some peanut that can't carry a decent speed

4Runner doesn't always go that fast... "Runner" is a misnomer...

Generally I don't mind if they keep a steady speed (80+ is fine on the 100kmh roads around here at times) It's when they suddenly drop to 50 or 60 (Toyota Camry's are great at that... especially near a university town) that it's a problem.
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Offline Joff

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #67 on: October 13, 2016, 12:03:43 PM »
Quote from: NewieCamper on October 13, 2016, 07:55:20 AM
Pretty sure I'm going to be stopping a few times to stretch the legs and refuel myself in 1800km, let alone stopping for kids. It makes a bit of sense if the fuel stops are few and far between, but for regular highway stuff a fuel stop is a reasonable opportunity to 'stop revive survive'. Jerry cans would be my option if we were going somewhere there wasn't fuel.

I don't have one for regular highway stuff. Come to think of it, I don't have a Landcruiser for regular highway stuff either. I have it for when I'm tooling around in remote areas heading up dead end tracks for 200km in the gulf or out to some obscure landmark in central WA. It is easy to used way more than std fuel capacity between fuel sightings out there when you are not looking for them
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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #68 on: October 13, 2016, 12:05:53 PM »
Quote from: Joff on October 13, 2016, 11:39:22 AM
Oh christ! now we have to have a trailer for our extra fuel hahaha. Can someone do the math on the break even point for towing a fuel trailer versus buying it at the bowser  ;D, I sure someone here has enough nerd time on their hands  :cheers:

Not all of us always have trailers in tow ya know.

Really? How odd. I suppose it take all types....:P ;D

 :cheers:
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Offline edz

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #69 on: October 13, 2016, 12:15:56 PM »
Quote from: Footy Shorts Shane on October 13, 2016, 08:45:11 AM
By juuuuust getting 300km to a tank, I'd love a long range tank, 4 even  ;D

But I'm too tight to buy one and after 300km in the crusty rusty Hilux, you want to stop and get out any way  :D
Hah our old Slow runner isnt much better at just over 400km,  But would love the grunt the V8 to justify it,   instead of the gutless thirsty V6  ;D
« Last Edit: October 13, 2016, 12:21:05 PM by edz »
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Offline Footy Shorts Shane

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #70 on: October 13, 2016, 12:33:52 PM »
Quote from: edz on October 13, 2016, 12:15:56 PM
Hah our old Slow runner isnt much better at just over 400km,  But would love the grunt the V8 to justify it,   instead of the gutless thirsty V6  ;D

I considered removing the Chev to fit one of those 6's to increase economy, until I researched the consumption of the 6.
Was a quick and easy decision to keep the Chev  ;D
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Offline edz

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #71 on: October 13, 2016, 12:55:32 PM »
And the Chev would have  more room in the engine bay and at least be Sooo much easier / cheaper to work on too .
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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #72 on: October 19, 2016, 05:59:52 AM »
KB
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Offline Fizzie

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #73 on: October 19, 2016, 07:26:23 AM »
& is that a 44 in the back of the ute?

Knew Toy's were thirsty but didn't realise it was that bad!  ;D
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Offline Pete79

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Re: Tonights puzzler.... at what point does extra range become a burden?
« Reply #74 on: October 19, 2016, 08:51:48 AM »
Quote from: Fizzie on October 19, 2016, 07:26:23 AM
& is that a 44 in the back of the ute?

Knew Toy's were thirsty but didn't realise it was that bad!  ;D
That's so they can get to the servo to fill up the long range tank. ;)
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