Author Topic: Rainbow Beach claims 2 more. (Read 39284 times)

JD-120 · « **Reply #50 on:** March 03, 2015, 03:34:26 PM »

Quote from: edz on March 03, 2015, 03:31:10 PM

could shave about 30 to 40 minutes on a good trip .

or if not so good.........

prodigyrf · « **Reply #51 on:** March 03, 2015, 03:40:31 PM »

Quote from: gv 2003 on February 25, 2015, 06:02:17 PM

check is page out
http://www.ourrainbowbeach.com.au/our-rainbow-beach/rainbow-beach/mudlo-rocks.html

Obviously no Suzukis among them as they're definitely not miscellaneous 4WDs and naturally they're driven by intelligent discerning afficionados of fine machinery

BaseCamp · « **Reply #52 on:** March 03, 2015, 05:22:36 PM »

Sand conditions are constantly changing through those rocks - and recent cyclonic swells would have helped gouge out a few gazillion tons of sand as well...

The last time i drove over those rocks was about a year or 2 ago... Prior to that was in the good old days with dad in our series 3 - in the 1970's...

So about last year I am driving along from Noosa - fully cautious; eyes sweeping back and forth - on guard for those inevitable vehicle destroyers .... to then suddenly find myself at Rainbow...

Breezed across the rocks like a sand highway - with barely a bit of a rock to be seen anywhere...

But now today - total "Carnage for Dummies"....

speewa158 · « **Reply #53 on:** March 03, 2015, 07:26:35 PM »

With your Ball in Hand you go around the wet side of the Rocks . lf it turns to Sh!t then its your problem , Enjoy

weeds · « **Reply #54 on:** March 03, 2015, 09:19:27 PM »

Quote from: chester ver2.0 on March 03, 2015, 03:07:34 PM

Never been there before can someone answer

A are you forced to go around the rocks as there is no other way

or

B Is there a bypass track and this is simply the fools shortcut so to speak

If you drive all the way to the rocks, even with good planning at low tide and the rocks are exposed it's a fair drive doubling back to get to rainbow.

I would say by-passing the rock from the rocks would be 1 1/2 hrs......

Why many are tempted is you are literally a couple of hundred meters for the town. There is a park above the rocks with the caravan park across the street.

Nomad · « **Reply #55 on:** March 03, 2015, 09:53:21 PM »

Rainbow Beach has to be one of the most interesting beaches in terms of sand movement that I have ever seen. It is one of a few large north facing bays in Qld, much larger than both Mooloolaba and Noosa and probably on par with Byron. But it has massive sand movement in comparison to any of the above.

I went up on the weekend and the sandspits out from the point were the lowest and most tidally influenced I have seen them in a long time. To the point that if we get another big swell they may disappear for a while

The bit of beach right in front of the rocks seems to be were it turns more easterly again and cops alot more swell than even 100 metres to the south. Thats why I think the gutter there has formed up again, waves break over outer sandbank, hit rock and bounce back into more waves and start to gouge the beach away and the gutter forms. Plus big tides sweeping around the bay into that particular spot.

The whole thing may reverse again next week and sand will form up around the rocks again adnwe may not see another wrecked vehicle for a while.

edz · « **Reply #56 on:** March 03, 2015, 10:02:37 PM »

Yep more than once have planned on using freshwater because of no sand a week out from going and a week later you check it befor leaving and you wouldnt even get a wheel wet ..

Elky · « **Reply #57 on:** March 04, 2015, 09:04:26 PM »

Until the cyclone came it was pretty easy to get past mudlo at anytime, last 6 months were pretty consistent. I wouldn't use freshwater unless forced to, is the long way round and less scenic

So I guess the smashed trucks have been recovered?

edz · « **Reply #58 on:** March 04, 2015, 10:34:47 PM »

Last pic put up . With a Q of is there a car under there .

prodigyrf · « **Reply #59 on:** March 05, 2015, 09:38:47 AM »

'Oh what a feeling!'....'vroom vroom!'...' Go further'...' The power of dreams'....'Everything we do is driven by you'...Never Follow'...'The road will never be the same'..etc, etc

http://www.thinkslogans.com/slogans/advertising-slogans/car-slogans/

Elky · « **Reply #60 on:** March 05, 2015, 03:02:08 PM »

Add the dmax/mux ad "you can go your own way" to the list

JohngQld447 · « **Reply #61 on:** March 05, 2015, 07:55:28 PM »

I used this thread and its pictures for our monthly safety meeting, Tuesday of this week. I asked the group to put forward what were the contributing factors for the 2 vehicles in the original post. Top of the list, D***H***S, idiots that should know better, act of god, (Intelligence level I thought), but no thought of sympathy at all. Add in , What would you expect from someone who drives a Toyota. (their quote not mine). I was trying to use it to show what happens without planning, situational awareness, assumptions, poor information, no back up plan, this is what can happen. I also showed the video of us going past the same location in November. Still the root cause was complete lack of intelligence.
I then told the final story of how it was eight o clock at night, high tide, and cyclone Marcie pounding the coast, oh and they were a group of surfies. First question was how does a surfie afford a 200 series Toyota, Maybe it was Dad's , just borrowed for the day. Root Cause Analysis from the room, complete lack of intelligence. Yes and all our insurance premiums will cover it.
John

Nomad · « **Reply #62 on:** March 05, 2015, 09:43:01 PM »

Intersting answers seeing as two of the three cars that went under in that period were Holdens. Plenty of surfers around here drive 200's. Sounds like a smart ar$e answer from a smart ar$e to me.

You state the root cause was complete lack of intelligence. Maybe, maybe not. How do you know the guy in the cruiser was not trying to help the guy in the Jackaroo, or vice versa and got stuck themselves....no one has reported an interview from the drivers of either vehicle

What does November last year have to do with how the beach is today. Any one who drives on the beach regularly knows the beach changes not daily but hourly. Thinking back one of the worst times I had to drive up and down the beach was in the pouring rain to pick up someone who's car had broken down......didn't think so at the time but I could barely see the waterline and could have easily have put us too low into the surf.

Cyclone Marcia was well past Rainbow by the 23rd and the surf had started to die very quickly............trust me I was at Noosa sitting in the surf watching it drop every set.

If they went in the drink at 8.00pm that night it was about half tide, so on the upper end of what would normally be passable but in this case not so.

It is a complete lack of experience that is the cause of these types of stranding. Night time driving,salt spray and black rocks are a drivers worst enemy, but it takes experience to recognise that.

I think your room's assessment "of a complete lack of intelligence" is simplistic and show that they need further education.

If you have a look at the Rainbow Beach recovery pages you'll see that there is a photo of a very experienced Rainbow Beach operator bogged a bit north from where these vehicles went down, so its not that hard to do. Personally I have had to drive through the lagoon on mid tide when I had a sick child and had salt water over my bonnet, but had calculated the risk....I made it but does that make my intelligence level low?

Cheers Nomad.

Footy Shorts Shane · « **Reply #63 on:** March 06, 2015, 05:21:12 AM »

Quote from: Nomad on March 05, 2015, 09:43:01 PM

If you have a look at the Rainbow Beach recovery pages you'll see that there is a photo of a very experienced Rainbow Beach operator bogged a bit north from where these vehicles went down, so its not that hard to do.

Cheers Nomad.

I saw that. Did he/she stop?

Shane.

edz · « **Reply #64 on:** March 06, 2015, 11:27:39 AM »

Some close ups of the damaged cruiser in the link too www.facebook.com/rainbowbeachtowing

Bird · « **Reply #65 on:** March 06, 2015, 11:31:05 AM »

Quote from: edz on March 06, 2015, 11:27:39 AM

Some close ups of the damaged cruiser in the link too www.facebook.com/rainbowbeachtowing

I see someone took my advice and got the LHS rear blinker out

chester ver2.0 · « **Reply #66 on:** March 06, 2015, 12:45:33 PM »

Quote from: JohngQld447 on March 05, 2015, 07:55:28 PM

I used this thread and its pictures for our monthly safety meeting, Tuesday of this week. I asked the group to put forward what were the contributing factors for the 2 vehicles in the original post. Top of the list, D***H***S, idiots that should know better, act of god, (Intelligence level I thought), but no thought of sympathy at all. Add in , What would you expect from someone who drives a Toyota. (their quote not mine). I was trying to use it to show what happens without planning, situational awareness, assumptions, poor information, no back up plan, this is what can happen. I also showed the video of us going past the same location in November. Still the root cause was complete lack of intelligence.
I then told the final story of how it was eight o clock at night, high tide, and cyclone Marcie pounding the coast, oh and they were a group of surfies. First question was how does a surfie afford a 200 series Toyota, Maybe it was Dad's , just borrowed for the day. Root Cause Analysis from the room, complete lack of intelligence. Yes and all our insurance premiums will cover it.
John

The fact that it is a 1 and a half hour double back or go around the rocks the root cause is actually a mistake in the risk vs reward analysis that they used to base their descision on.

The reward is a saving in time and effort and they based this on a percieved risk of picking their way through the rocks, but there is an actual risk of the rocks plus a surface that would not support the weight of the vehicle.

So the root cause is a fault in the risk assessment process of not understanding all the variables and hazards involved. It is a classic example of why when we do large scale risk assessments at work it is always a team effort with experts and cold eyes.

To put this in play simply means did they stop and discuss as a group someone may have gone "does anyone know how soft the sand is" and in my workplace if the answer was no then the job or crossing as it is would not have gone ahead as a key hazard variable is still undefined

What this has to be tempered with is the inherant nature of humans we are by nature lazy creatures if there is an easier, cheaper, faster way of doing it we will almost universally take that option, now whilst that was grat in caveman times and got us to the top of the food chain it often does not work in the modern world with increased hazards and complexities

prodigyrf · « **Reply #67 on:** March 06, 2015, 03:00:49 PM »

Talking of 'insurance will cover it', do some policies or their fine print fail to cover submersion or do the premiums simply reflect the added risk? I know with my house the onliner Budget Insurance openly and specifically precludes flood risk (and insuring the NT would you believe?) and as a result touts that as one reason they can keep premiums low (keeps out the low types

).

chester ver2.0 · « **Reply #68 on:** March 06, 2015, 03:16:34 PM »

Quote from: prodigyrf on March 06, 2015, 03:00:49 PM

Talking of 'insurance will cover it', do some policies or their fine print fail to cover submersion or do the premiums simply reflect the added risk? I know with my house the onliner Budget Insurance openly and specifically precludes flood risk (and insuring the NT would you believe?) and as a result touts that as one reason they can keep premiums low (keeps out the low types ).

Yeah i have heard of others that will only cover to a high water mark and you are on your own below that

BaseCamp · « **Reply #69 on:** March 06, 2015, 06:03:40 PM »

Quote from: Nomad on March 05, 2015, 09:43:01 PM

It is a complete lack of experience that is the cause of these types of stranding. Night time driving,salt spray and black rocks are a drivers worst enemy, but it takes experience to recognise that.

I think your room's assessment "of a complete lack of intelligence" is simplistic and show that they need further education.

Well not quite - actually...

The drivers in question may hopefully be "educated" now - post them potentially destroying 2 expensive 4WDs

BUT the piper who pays for that "education" is all us other mugs as comprehensively insured - whom pick up the tab on the cost - with higher insurance premiums...

In the unlikely event Brain became (slightly) engaged prior to them entering the rocks; I wonder whether they ever considered their "risk assessment" status okay to plow on... "because we've got insurance"?? grrr

BUT the central point of my post is this....

At what point does "Lack of Experience" become moot?

Eg: in a driving situation - I have "lack experience and ability" to successfully and accurately reverse turn park a 4WD towing a big caravan....

Result - I scrape up the side = "my lack of experience and competence"

Eg: in a driving situation - I am "irresponsible; stupid; and negligent" .... i reverse straight over the top of a mother and her 4yo daughter at a carnival; killing them both...

Clearly that is not a "lack of experience" situation

I can only assume based on what happened at Mudlo rocks - that the drivers were inexperienced in driving period...

THEREFORE WHAT THE FREAK WERE THEY THINKING - driving into surf and waves and rocks on a beach at 8pm.... (sorry if some of the details of the case are inaccurate)??

Their general (I assume) lack of driving time on normal black top roads etc SHOULD HAVE SAID TO THEM ---- NO DON'T ATTEMPT THIS AT ALL....

Were the drivers' drug or drunk tested .... Why/how such "irresponsible; stupid; and negligence" occurs - may I ask???

prodigyrf · « **Reply #70 on:** March 06, 2015, 08:16:12 PM »

"Were the drivers' drug or drunk tested .... Why/how such "irresponsible; stupid; and negligence" occurs - may I ask???"

You mean take ALL the personal responsibility for what you pour down your gullet?

What desert island have you been living on? We are ALL to blame more or less because these people are victims of our society-

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/penneshaw-hotel-prosecuted-for-irresponsible-service-of-alcohol-to-man-who-died-in-drink-drive-crash/story-fni6uo1m-1227250001829

Nomad · « **Reply #71 on:** March 06, 2015, 08:49:40 PM »

Quote from: BaseCamp on March 06, 2015, 06:03:40 PM

Well not quite - actually...

The drivers in question may hopefully be "educated" now - post them potentially destroying 2 expensive 4WDs I think you need to reread my post as a response to JohnyQld. I was talking about the people he was getting answers from

BUT the piper who pays for that "education" is all us other mugs as comprehensively insured - whom pick up the tab on the cost - with higher insurance premiums... Do you really think 3 write off's realtive to the insurance pool that is "Australia" really makes a difference to your premium. Yes I understand its cumulative, however I think you will find that much more garden variety accidents form a far greater proportion of insurance claims

At what point does "Lack of Experience" become moot?

Eg: in a driving situation - I am "irresponsible; stupid; and negligent" .... i reverse straight over the top of a mother and her 4yo daughter at a carnival; killing them both...

Clearly that is not a "lack of experience" situation

And not even a scenario that is REMOTELY relative to these couple of accidents. I think you mistake the damage to the cars as happening as part of an accident. That is not the case. THe cars cross over a short section of gutter onto a sand bank and either become bogged or overcome by a wave and stop, or drive into a hole and lose momentum and then stop. What you see on the photos is what is left of the vehicles after they have had a wash in the surf for the night being bounced around on the rocks.

I can only assume based on what happened at Mudlo rocks - that the drivers were inexperienced in driving period...ASSUME makes an ASS of U & ME

THEREFORE WHAT THE FREAK WERE THEY THINKING - driving into surf and waves and rocks on a beach at 8pm.... (sorry if some of the details of the case are inaccurate)?? Rainbow Beach locals have been doing it for years and in 90% of cases there is never a story to tell

Their general (I assume) lack of driving time on ~~normal black top roads~~ ~~etc~~ THE BEACH SHOULD HAVE SAID TO THEM ---- NO DON'T ATTEMPT THIS AT ALL.... Fixed that for ya.
There is no other place that you can drive anywhere, where things can change so quickly, and if you spend enough time on the beach you will see some scenarios that only an ocean can through at you. I remember sitting in line to go across from DI to Rainbow, the surf was about three foot and a freak wave came through and turned a Triton on its side...............

Were the drivers' drug or drunk tested .... Why/how such "irresponsible; stupid; and negligence" occurs - may I ask???

Its easy to say these guys are morons and lack intelligence and are dumb surfies driving mom and dads car etc, but the fact is none of them have made a statement about the situation, and are unlikely to given the media profile that these rocks know get due to the facebook page.

I would wager there are still a sh!teload more accidents on DI beach from stupidity, drugs and booze than Mudlo Rocks, infact I would wager there are a similar number of accidents at similar rock passes on Fraser but because they don't have their own facebook page they don't generate the commentary.

Cheers Nomad.

Nomad · « **Reply #72 on:** March 06, 2015, 10:16:35 PM »

Quote from: Footy Shorts Shane on March 06, 2015, 05:21:12 AM

I saw that. Did he/she stop?

Shane.

Not sure. Didn't look too hard to drive out of but unless your there who knows.....maybe stalled?

weeds · « **Reply #73 on:** March 07, 2015, 08:12:07 AM »

The worry I have is what action authorities might take to prevent this happening in the future..........

Close driving on the beach to the general public??

weeds · « **Reply #74 on:** March 07, 2015, 08:15:49 AM »

Re root causes investigations in the workplace.......I have never seen lack of intelligence as the primary, if your work is putting you in a situation ole this the root causes would all be corporate short falls. I'm thinking risk assessment, training, competent, planning etc etc

I'm sure it's cause some pain to the drivers.....hopefully that have learnt something out of this.

News:

Author Topic: Rainbow Beach claims 2 more. (Read 39284 times)