Confusion on House solar panels

[terravista]

We had 3kW of solar panels put on the roof hooked up to a 5kW box.
The spiel from the sub-continent sales person said that during the day you should use any electrical items like washing machines, dishwashers fridges etc as they use the solar power first and anything not used is fed back into the grid.
Our power bill still shows pretty much the same peak and off peak usage we had before the solar was installed, the only difference is a staggering $58 discount which means the panels will pay for themselves in 18 years or so (woo hoo).
I would have thought that if the solar unit powered the running white goods first, the peak meter would show less power used.
Being far from knowlegeable in solar systems this may well be correct but seems to be different to what the salesman was saying, and we all know sales people are honest.
Do any swaggers out there know whether the grid power still powers these daytime items or  should the peak meter show a reduction in usage as the solar system generates power for them?
Thanks
Ian 

[cardinal28]

Hi Ian
I am led to believe whatever you produce goes directly into the grid and you buy back whatever you use, no matter what time of day it is. Same as normal, the costs will vary depending on the time of day (onpeak/offpeak).

[LuckyDog]

Same as with our Solar set up, but we have a 5kw unit and there is significant difference with our bill, it used to be around $750 @ qtr and now we may get around $150 credit per qtr, you should also be watching your meter or inverter to make sure its working properly, ours faulted due to faulty installation and we never knew for a month or 2 till we got our next bill and saw the increase $$ again

but i am sure there are members here that are more familiar with the exact houshold solar setups than i am.

[richee]

The spiel from the sub-continent sales person said that during the day you should use any electrical items like washing machines, dishwashers fridges etc as they use the solar power first and anything not used is fed back into the grid.

I too am led to believe this is correct.

This web page shows how it is supposed to work (no affiliation, page chosen at random)
https://www.eurosolar.com.au/how-solar-system-works

Silly question - Has your meter been updated and has your solar system been connected to the Grid?

I suggest you contact your solar company and have them come out and check the system out.

Richard

[prodigyrf]

If you're on the FIT scheme like us where you get more for feeding into the grid than you pay using the grid then clearly it pays to do the laundry, dishwashing and run the aircon at night to maximise feed-in to the grid. If you're on 1 for 1 then it won't matter when you consume but without generous FIT the payback is much longer as you're aware. Smart meters whereby night rates (excluding off-peak HW) are reduced might change that equation but commercial/industrial users are the predominant installers of solar now ex FIT schemes as they generally pay higher rates than residential and barely use power at night when they've knocked off. None of us can avoid seasonal peak rates however.

[NewieCamper]

Ours is set up to export everything as we got the super rate (60c) when it was on offer (NSW). At 60c our 1.5kW setup generates enough income we haven't paid for electricity since the install. Now the rates for export are so low (20c?) it should be set up to use the solar first, then import what you don't generate, or export what you don't use.

Sounds like yours is set up the wrong way.

[terravista]

This web page shows how it is supposed to work (no affiliation, page chosen at random)
https://www.eurosolar.com.au/how-solar-system-works

It may be a coincidence but that company has the same name as our suppliers.
When the system was first installed they stuffed something up and we lost 3 months worth of solar rebates completely so maybe it still is not correct. Now we at least are receiving some rebate but certainly not enough to justify the expense.
We are paying a peak rate of roughly 42 cents/kW but only get back 12 cents/kW, so any solar we can use first is a bonus.
Thanks
Ian

[NewieCamper]

A 3kW setup should give you heaps of power available in the daytime. If you do most of your washing, vacuuming etc while the sun is shining then at the very least your power consumption should have dropped. Get your system checked, maybe by an independent sparky.

[chisel]

You're not allowed to export 100% of what your solar provides (unless your house is using 0 watts).  Whatever your house is using is sourced from the solar panels first.  Of course if you have a very high FIT it makes sense to *minimise* daily usage and export whatever you can .... at least if making money is your primary goal.

If you have a (now-standard) low FIT of 8-16c/kWh then you should try to use all the solar power you can as this is saving you 30-40c/kWh.  So yes, run dishwashers, washing machines etc during the day.  But be careful not to run them all at once though as you'll end up only powering half of them with solar and have to pay for the rest of the power you use.  Better to stagger them, and also use them when the sun is out if possible.

There's a whirlpool forum called Green Tech http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum/143 which covers all these sort of questions all the time. 

[HKB Electronics]

The solar unit feeds back into the consumer side of the switch board.

Therefore any power your panels produce is used by the household
appliances first, any excess is feedback to the grid.

Your meter will show the power that is consumed from the grid and
the excess you generated that was exported.

Keep in mind the panels will only produce their rated power in bright sunshine.

If your consumption hasn't dropped have you installed something new that may be
consuming more power?

Some suppliers allow you to log in a view your usage, if yours does it is worth registering
for access.

As pointed out above, if your getting a high feed in tariff, then your better off not using
power during the day and doing washing etc during off peak times. If your on a low feed
in then use what you can during the day but try and keep it below the level the panels are
producing to avoid importing power at peak rates.

[terravista]

The solar unit feeds back into the consumer side of the switch board.

Therefore any power your panels produce is used by the household
appliances first, any excess is feedback to the grid.

Your meter will show the power that is consumed from the grid and
the excess you generated that was exported.

Keep in mind the panels will only produce their rated power in bright sunshine.

If your consumption hasn't dropped have you installed something new that may be
consuming more power?

Some suppliers allow you to log in a view your usage, if yours does it is worth registering
for access.

As pointed out above, if your getting a high feed in tariff, then your better off not using
power during the day and doing washing etc during off peak times. If your on a low feed
in then use what you can during the day but try and keep it below the level the panels are
producing to avoid importing power at peak rates.

Thanks for the response.
There does not seem to be a corresponding drop in the peak meter reading that would account for the solar that has been generated. I would have thought if some solar generated power was used and some was sent back to the grid, there should be a drop in the peak meter reading, but there isn't.
The Previous quarter without the solar connected properly used 900 kW of peak power and 300kW of off peak power, and the current quarter had pretty much the same numbers although there was around 400kw returned to the grid.
Cheers
Ian
 

[grafy82]

As has been said, if you are receiving a high feed in tariff then try not to use any power during the day to get paid for all of your feed in at a high rate, then use your appliances at night, essentially buying back the power at a lower price.

[HKB Electronics]

Thanks for the response.
There does not seem to be a corresponding drop in the peak meter reading that would account for the solar that has been generated. I would have thought if some solar generated power was used and some was sent back to the grid, there should be a drop in the peak meter reading, but there isn't.
The Previous quarter without the solar connected properly used 900 kW of peak power and 300kW of off peak power, and the current quarter had pretty much the same numbers although there was around 400kw returned to the grid.
Cheers
Ian
 

The amount your meter shows as imported should have reduced considerably with
the installation of your system. The fact that you returned 400kW to the grid indicates
that your system is generating more than your using at times.

I'm not sure what you mean by "without the solar connected properly" I'm assuming
the system has been installed by a licensed contractor?

My 3kW system in Melbourne averaged 288kWh last month, I exported 101kWh
so my imported power would have been 187kWh less, or around 6kWh less a day,
as shown on the meter, yours should be doing a lot better than that.

Can only suggest you look at the appliances you have running and work out their consumption
and see if what your meter is showing seems reasonable.

[jetcrew]

Need more info...

Location

Deal your on with relation to FIT amount

date the system was activated.

Who your elec account is with.

then at least the answerers can be specific at present they are all general responses

Jet

[WilSurf]

Are you sure that you are not using now more power because "it is free"?

[terravista]

Need more info...

Location

Deal your on with relation to FIT amount

date the system was activated.

Who your elec account is with.

then at least the answerers can be specific at present they are all general responses

Jet

Thanks

House is in Kooralbyn 22km west of South West of Beaudesert.
Feed in tarrif is 12c/kW
System was supposedly activated back in April, but they screwed up and properly activated in mid June.
Power is through Power Direct.

[terravista]

Are you sure that you are not using now more power because "it is free"?

I wish it was that simple, but the house has one resident (my daughter) and I am sure the washing machine, vacuum, stove and everything else has not had an increase in use.
Cheers
ian

[jetcrew]

Thanks for the response.
There does not seem to be a corresponding drop in the peak meter reading that would account for the solar that has been generated. I would have thought if some solar generated power was used and some was sent back to the grid, there should be a drop in the peak meter reading, but there isn't.
The Previous quarter without the solar connected properly used 900 kW of peak power and 300kW of off peak power, and the current quarter had pretty much the same numbers although there was around 400kw returned to the grid.
Cheers
Ian
 

900Kw in 90 days is a very very low peak power usage figure..I do not know many houses running on 10Kw per day add the 300 off peak = 13.3Kw per 24 hrs thats awesome on its own.


So 1 occupant that explains the 13.3 Kw .. we need to establish the time that your daughter uses power does she work all day ?   

[HKB Electronics]

Funny you should say that, my friend was telling me about his neighbor, they were
complaining about a large increase in their power bill, they indicated the only one there
during the day was the border. Turned out the border was having his girlfriend over
during the day and there was a lot of naked goings on requiring the heating to be
turned up! 

[jetcrew]

Funny you should say that, my friend was telling me about his neighbor, they were
complaining about a large increase in their power bill, they indicated the only there
during the day was the border. Turned out the border was having his girlfriend over
during the day and there was a lot of naked goings on requiring the heating to be
turned up!

Lucky fella 

I wish solar increased my goings on LOL

[HKB Electronics]

My peak usage is around 10kWh, my off peak about the same, my supplier
in their usage tables indicates that I'm using quite a bit more than comparable
houses in my area!

[jetcrew]

I have just dropped to a 6c feed in tarif  .

I exported 1501 to the grid last quarter

1501 kWh @ 52c = $780.52

1501kWh @ 44c = $660.44

1501 kWh @ 14c = $210.14

1501 kWh @ 6c =  $90.06

My total bill here at home for the quarter is $210.00  so I have gone from zero bill to $210. these figures show that all the govt needed to do was maintain a FIT at 50% of the nominal tariff rate and houses could be power neutral.

even at 6c FIT I am saving myself $500 a bill so 2K per year , first 12mths save 3K . about a 4 year payback. But the saving is not in what I sell to the grid it is in what i don't IMPORT / BUY to my house from the grid. not buying is 5 X better than selling.

more than ever solar systems need to be designed and installed properly the fly by knight people and the big corpartes who knew nothing of solar before the rebates are now being shown as very poor choices for solar as that top figure $780.52 means the system could have been only 75% efficent and I would never have noticed. With diminished FIT the system must be efficient and tailored to the specific family situation.

Split arrays are now the norm and the arrays being sighted to correspond with peak power times of the day. if your only getting 6c a kWh then selling is worthless it is worth 5 X more for you to use that kWh in the home. so a lower overall system generation may in fact save you money if everything generated is being used thus saving you 30c for the unit of power.

A crude example all day whilst your at work and kids at school the panels are selling your power unit for 6c to the power company lets say it generates 12kWh and the installer has sighted it for MAX generation and between 10am - 3pm it is well sighted and pumping ot 12kWh to the grid. then the kids get home and the power usage ramps up at the same time the solar generation is ramping down.

So i would rather sight my panels to cover the usage pattern i have n/e and W n/w this way my generation peaks match my household usage peaks and I am not buing power units. That is my specific situation each family will have different patterns.

IMHO total system generation is no longer as important as matching generation to usage time. This is what will save you money. no one has a system that exports 5 x what they use. residential that is.

Confused yet  

[paceman]

so how are you guys accurately determining what your usage patterns are like, by day, week, month, etc...?

do you have specific meters for this?  are they available to buy?

or are you going on just your power bill info?

[jetcrew]

so how are you guys accurately determining what your usage patterns are like, by day, week, month, etc...?

do you have specific meters for this?  are they available to buy?

or are you going on just your power bill info?

Obv there are meters and such that you can buy that will display what is being drawn from the grid. i was a little more rudimentary and just decided to take note of when and how we used our power.

i fopund that 6.30am - 8.30am was a heavy period for us.

J

[slcs78]

We have a 3kw system. Before solar our avg bill was $900 per qtr. We only get a 6c per kw feed in tariff. My wife is home most days with the kids and we try to use appliances during the day. Since installed our bills are $500-600 with a rebate of about $60 dollars or so. We will pay for the system in 3 1/2 years