Author Topic: A serious which 4WD question?  (Read 52131 times)

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Offline oldmate

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #150 on: September 23, 2014, 06:10:33 AM »
Well after seeing the burnt out FJ on Fraser post, we've settled on a new Navara V6 Turbo Diesel. Managed to find a white one today and just wrapping up the deal with the local dealer. Definitely won't be a tradie truck, so watch for a new thread to come soon..........
It'll be a sheep with bling and a smile:-)


 ;D ;D. Nothing like a sheep with a gold chain.  ;D.

Can't wait to see pics of it coming together.
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Offline cruza driver

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #151 on: September 23, 2014, 07:44:52 AM »
Awesome Scarps, when is delivery?
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Offline lino6

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #152 on: September 23, 2014, 07:48:35 AM »
I wonder if speewa will be happy to be seen in this one, I still remember the look on his face when he decided to get into the Jeep!
SWMBO reminds me of a Prodigy song....
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Offline Bird

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #153 on: September 23, 2014, 09:09:53 AM »
Change ya thread title.
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scarps

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #154 on: September 23, 2014, 11:07:39 AM »
Awesome Scarps, when is delivery?
Sometime next week if all the extra's come together in the next few days.

Offline cruza driver

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #155 on: September 23, 2014, 07:04:02 PM »
Sometime next week if all the extra's come together in the next few days.

Nice mate, not to far away then.
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scarps

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #156 on: September 23, 2014, 07:53:39 PM »
New build thread started over in My 4WD section.

Offline D4D

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #157 on: September 28, 2014, 08:15:20 AM »
I was bored so I crunched the numbers on a couple of scenarios:
- Run the Prado as I do now (Prado)
- Get a runabout (Camry) and keep the Prado as a weekender (Prado 2)

The numbers are surprising. Running the Prado as a daily driver only costs $3,300 extra per year vs. an additional $12,400 to run a 2nd vehicle and keeping the Prado for trips/weekends. I haven't factored in any tax offset.

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scarps

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #158 on: September 28, 2014, 08:21:31 AM »

I was bored so I crunched the numbers on a couple of scenarios:
- Run the Prado as I do now (Prado)
- Get a runabout (Camry) and keep the Prado as a weekender (Prado 2)

The numbers are surprising. Running the Prado as a daily driver only costs $3,300 extra per year vs. an additional $12,400 to run a 2nd vehicle and keeping the Prado for trips/weekends. I haven't factored in any tax offset.


good scenarios, does the Camry column include finance?

Offline D4D

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #159 on: September 28, 2014, 08:22:12 AM »
good scenarios, does the Camry column include finance?

Yup, that's the 'lease' row :)
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scarps

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A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #160 on: September 28, 2014, 08:23:47 AM »
Yup, that's the 'lease' row :)
doh, it's Sunday morning, forgive me

In which case, you have to weigh up the cost of putting extra km's on the Prado versus upgrading it every few years
« Last Edit: September 28, 2014, 08:25:19 AM by scarps »

Offline D4D

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #161 on: September 28, 2014, 08:29:35 AM »
In which case, you have to weigh up the cost of putting extra km's on the Prado versus upgrading it every few years

True, but at the moment the Prado is fully depreciated and won't lose a whole lot more per year as a daily driver or weekender. Plus that hurts my brain to work out that formula on a Sunday morning.
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scarps

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #162 on: September 28, 2014, 08:32:11 AM »

True, but at the moment the Prado is fully depreciated and won't lose a whole lot more per year as a daily driver or weekender. Plus that hurts my brain to work out that formula on a Sunday morning.
plus when you hear of good quality 4wd's getting up to the 400,000km's and still running strong, it's possibly less of an issue.

Offline D4D

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #163 on: September 28, 2014, 08:38:28 AM »
Added in the tax offset @ 50% business use.

Delta between daily driver and weekender is now only $1,325
Delta between running 1 and 2 vehicles is now $10,450

Hardly seems worth it to run 2...

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Offline Garfish

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #164 on: September 28, 2014, 11:36:17 AM »
Hi d4d. It's interesting that from your figures that the prado is more economical than the Camry, I assume that Camry + prado 2 km would equal prado km, I.e. No additional km are driven through the addition of the second vehicle .  The reason I query this is the fuel spend for 2 vehicles is $500 more. I would of thought that the distance travelled   Thus could be correct but just thought it looks strange.   It's the accountant in me coming out.  But it is also why I went Micra for my daily commute. Which I got thrown in when I bought my D40.  A few years ago.  Good luck with the new dual cab
« Last Edit: September 28, 2014, 11:43:06 AM by Garfish »
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Offline D4D

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #165 on: September 28, 2014, 12:17:28 PM »
Hey Garfish, I started with a known, which is the Prado fuel usage and klms travelled, hence the $3500 is accurate. Looking at the Camry specs it gets about a 1/3 better fuel economy than the Prado hence the $2600 for the same klms as the Prado as a daily driver. It should probably be $2300 as unleaded is cheaper than diesel. The $1500 for the 'Prado 2' scenario was a finger in the air estimate based on weekend and trip usage, hence lower klms than the Camry. Does that make sense?
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Offline Ratbag

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #166 on: September 28, 2014, 12:45:53 PM »
Gidday D4D

Added in the tax offset @ 50% business use.

Delta between daily driver and weekender is now only $1,325
Delta between running 1 and 2 vehicles is now $10,450

Hardly seems worth it to run 2...




Always an interesting exercise.

Perhaps you could separate out fixed costs and depreciation (real, not tax deductible) from running costs, then convert them all back into a cents/km cost, then work out the annualised cost of each vehicle and option set from there?

It is very easy to tax deduct one's self out of an income, if you get my drift.

There are also non-quantifiable costs/benefits to be taken into account. We choose to have two vehicles because of our personal needs and wants. My brother and his wife have just chosen to go from two vehicles to one for the same (different ... ) needs and wants analysis.

It's the accountant coming out in me, as Garfish said ;).

Just a few thoughts, FWIW.

scarps

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #167 on: September 28, 2014, 02:16:28 PM »
Maybe we should start a new thread called:

Estimating the serious cost of owning and running vehicles?

Offline slcs78

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #168 on: September 28, 2014, 02:26:27 PM »
Maybe we should start a new thread called:

Estimating the serious cost of owning and running vehicles?

Sometimes I think its best not to know lol ;D
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Offline Ratbag

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Re: A serious which 4WD question?
« Reply #169 on: September 28, 2014, 03:05:07 PM »
Gidday Scarps

Maybe we should start a new thread called:

Estimating the serious cost of owning and running vehicles?

Cheapest car I ever owned was a mid/late-1980s Mitsubishi Colt. 23.5 cents/km, cradle to grave, not counting the value of the spares I took from it for Number 3 Colt ... That does include everything: fuel, servicing, repairs (boy, did it need lots of them ... ), tyres, rego, insurance, depreciation, loss of interest on our money, opportunity cost. The reason it was so cheap was because we bought it second hand, so the initial owner had paid heaps per km in depreciation that we didn't have to pay ...

The next cheapest was my '93 Subaru Impreza at around 33.5 c/km. This was bought new, and was almost completely tax deductible to my businesses (80+%). One has to keep impeccable records for this. It was sold after nearly 18 years and 236,000 kms. This calculation does not take the tax advantages into consideration.

My current car is a s/h 2006 Forester. It was bought with 100K kms on it in December 2011. Since the car is good for around 300K kms or 20 years (whichever comes first), it had around 2/3 of its mileage and life time left in it. Even depreciating it from new to the price we paid for it, the previous owners had paid around 24 c/km in depreciation from its delivery price (nearly $24,000 ... :( ). Of course, they would not have received anything like that amount when they sold/traded in the car.

Same deal with my wife's 'new' car. 2009 Forester bought s/h, not quite 3 y.o. with 61,000 kms on it (i.e. about 80% of its useful life left in kms and years). The initial owners had paid out some $18,000 in depreciation (same deal as above), about 29.51 c/km.

These depreciation costs "paid" by the initial owners (both were previously one owner cars with delivery at about 5 kms) are costs that we are "exempted" from paying.

It can easily be seen that depreciation and loss of interest on one's money are the single biggest cost in purchasing any car. Buying new often means that the depreciation is 20-25% from the moment one leaves the dealer's yard. This is why I say to work out the actual loss of value on an year by year basis. By the end of year 5, almost all of the car's value is gone in depreciation. However, the car is still practically new (usually), and will give one many years of trouble-free service at small cost, just so long as one is not silly enough to sell it at this point ...

Of course, there are always other costs associated with buying s/h cars. Usually tyres, major services, the occasional repair, etc. Even with a complete history there are unforeseen additional outlays. Full 4 wheel alignment and body straightness check with the first set of new tyres is one such expense.

My car needed a major service fairly promptly, and a new set of struts/springs at the rear (a known problem with the Subaru self-levelling suspension). SWMBO's needed a complete brake job at a bit over 80,000 kms (new pads all round; discs skimmed; fluid replaced). I also replaced the tranny oil (5MT/DR) as its condition was an unknown that I wasn't prepared to trust to luck on. Ditto the rear diff oil.

I always factor an estimate of these "unforeseen" costs into the s/h purchase equation. I also buy cars that have substantial warranties from reputable dealers (at a premium). However, most dealers don't know what they have with Subarus these days, so one can get very well equipped cars for ordinary prices, if one knows what one is looking for/at. SWMBO's car was priced as a base model, and the dealer only realised their mistake when transcribing the details of the car for the registration/title transfer. As the salesman said "Oh well. Too late now". It was the top end N/A with the Prodrive Sportshift 4EAT auto :)  ;D   :cheers: . I also grovel under the car and run all the seams with my fingers, look for any signs of abuse, etc, etc.

Interestingly, both cars are insured for an agreed sum that is much the same as the price we paid for them about 2 and 2.5 years ago respectively. Our insurer also agreed that we got two good ones.

Just some thoughts.