Author Topic: Dingo attack on Fraser  (Read 31834 times)

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Offline Jeepers Creepers

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #50 on: August 16, 2014, 07:50:12 AM »
Don't take this the wrong way..... but you're an idiot.
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Offline Petermac

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #51 on: August 16, 2014, 08:03:23 AM »
Wow. Now there's a clever argument.
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Offline GUEY

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #52 on: August 16, 2014, 08:04:55 AM »
Shoot the lot of them. Why we would want to protect an introduced species is beyond me - if they were pigs we wouldn't be having this discussion. My wife won't go to Frazer for fear that the kids will be attacked by a Dingo; what's the point of having National Parks if people can't enjoy them? And the crocs argument is bollocks - endemic animals are part of the ecosystem and part of the attraction. These are glorified ferals.

Interesting point. However I thought most of us where an introduced species also. Same could be said for the feral comment also.
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Offline Petermac

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #53 on: August 16, 2014, 08:12:32 AM »
Yes, I'd agree that humans are introduced too.  And to that extent I suppose I'm just accepting the argument that National Parks have been established for the enjoyment of every 'human', and therefore we all have a right to be there. We've certainly made more impact on the environment than any other animal. But I'm intrigued as to why people think Dingoes are so special? Is it because they are dogs? We certainly don't have the affinity for feral cats.
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Offline GUEY

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #54 on: August 16, 2014, 08:16:55 AM »
Thats where we differ. I was under the impression Nat Parks where set up to preserve wildlife and fauna. Not for our enjoyment.
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Offline Petermac

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #55 on: August 16, 2014, 08:28:58 AM »

Thats where we differ. I was under the impression Nat Parks where set up to preserve wildlife and fauna. Not for our enjoyment.

From the National Parks web page:

"Like zoos, national parks have several purposes. The foremost of these is to protect native flora and fauna. But national parks are also there so Australians and foreign visitors can enjoy and learn about our unique environment, heritage and culture."

Note the reference to NATIVE flora and fauna, and for visitors to enjoy.
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Offline GUEY

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #56 on: August 16, 2014, 08:54:11 AM »
Quotes? Ok, Also from the parks website.

"The survival of the Fraser Island dingoes relies on three management factors—education, engineering and enforcement. Fraser Island dingoes are part of the island ecology, and are protected by law"

The reason they are protected is they are thought to be the purest strain of dingo left.
And I think they have been around a bit longer than most of us.
"The Dingo is Australia's wild dog. It was probably introduced to Australia by Asian seafarers about 4,000 years ago. Its origins have been traced back to a south Asian variety of Grey Wolf (Canis lupus lupus). Recent DNA studies suggest that Dingoes may have been in Australia even longer (between 4,640-18,1000 years; Oskarsson et al 2011), however, the earliest undisputed archaeological finding of the Dingo in Australia has been dated to 3,500 years ago - See more at: http://australianmuseum.net.au/dingo#sthash.Fla2YA3c.dpuf "
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 08:56:16 AM by GUEY »
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Offline Rumpig

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #57 on: August 16, 2014, 09:26:12 AM »
Shoot the lot of them. Why we would want to protect an introduced species is beyond me - if they were pigs we wouldn't be having this discussion. My wife won't go to Frazer for fear that the kids will be attacked by a Dingo; what's the point of having National Parks if people can't enjoy them? And the crocs argument is bollocks - endemic animals are part of the ecosystem and part of the attraction. These are glorified ferals.
my guess is your just writing that as bait, but if not here goes...more fool your wife for being paranoid something might  happen to the family and not just go there and take sensible precautions to try and be sure the family is safe (you can never rule anything out 100% from possibly happening), educate yourselves at how the majority of attacks have happened and you'll see a common theme appearing. Take sensible precautions whilst on the island and you'd likely have more chance of being involved in a car accident on your holiday then being "attacked" by dingos. Plenty of people enjoy going to Fraser Island (about 380 000 people a year last i read), so not sure what your point is with not being able to enjoy going to that National Park, it's just a choice your family seems to have made not to go there.
We have been taking our kids there and beach camping since they were both 6 months old, keep an eye on them and don't let them wander off alone (don't let young kids wander off together either, should have an adult present) and you shouldn't have a problem. For us and for many others the dingos are part of the attraction of Fraser Island, but we are smart enough to realise where we are and adapt to the conditions to make it as safe as we can for our family whilst there. Waking up in the morning and seeing fresh dingo foot prints in your camp is part of the Fraser attraction for us, and i'm sure many other people also.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 09:29:54 AM by Rumpig »
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Offline Clouty

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #58 on: August 16, 2014, 09:27:05 AM »
Shoot the lot of them. Why we would want to protect an introduced species is beyond me - if they were pigs we wouldn't be having this discussion. My wife won't go to Frazer for fear that the kids will be attacked by a Dingo; what's the point of having National Parks if people can't enjoy them? And the crocs argument is bollocks - endemic animals are part of the ecosystem and part of the attraction. These are glorified ferals.
Ask this question.. Do you go camping?? Or you and your family stay at home and watch TV..

Cause you can just go to any old bush camp and be bitten by a spider, snake or kicked by a cow and horse if you get to close.. So are we going to get rid of cows and horse's now because they are introduced??
So doesn't really matter where you camp theres a chance that a little one or adult can be hurt..

Wake up and smell the roses buddy we live in a country where there's dangerous animals everywhere..


« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 09:28:47 AM by Clouty »

Offline wartim

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #59 on: August 16, 2014, 09:27:30 AM »
I'm with Jeepers,

FYI - The resident Dingoes on Fraser Island should be treated with respect and are an integral part of the World Heritage and tourism value the Island offers.  World Heritage areas are places listed under the World Heritage Convention that have cultural or natural values of such importance that they are recognised as sites of heritage for all people of the world.

Why is Fraser Island World Heritage Listed -:
Fraser Island is the biggest sand island in the world.
Half the world’s perched freshwater dune lakes are found here.
This island is home to the world’s purest-bred dingoes.
The only place On Earth Where Rainforest Grows In Sand At Elevations Of 200m
It helps us understand how the earth and living things develop over time
Fraser Island provides important examples of geological processes and biological evolution through
its ever changing sand dune formations; lakes of varying diversity, age and developmental stages; and
ecosystems that have developed in response to maritime conditions and nutrient poor soils.

Some facts about the Dingo

Dingoes cannot bark - but they can howl.
Dingoes have unique wrists in the canine world, capable of rotatation. This enables dingoes to use their paws like hands and turn door knobs. Their ability to go where other dogs can't means dingoes can cause more problems for humans than other wild members of the dog family can.
A dingo can turn its head through almost 180 degrees in each direction.
Dingoes have permanently erect ears.
Dingoes can be found living in Australia and Southeast Asia, mainly Thailand.
Australian dingoes are larger than Asian dingoes.  Which means our Dingoes have evolved and are unique to Australia.
The plural of dingo is dingoes, not dingos.
Male dingoes are larger than females. Males weigh 26 to 43 pounds (12 to 20 kg) and females weigh 21 to 35 pounds.
Most Australian dingoes are ginger-coloured or sandy coloured with white chests. There are also dark coloured dingoes.
Wild dingoes can live for up to ten years but usually live for more like five or six years.
dingo-woodland
Dingoes cared for by people can live up to 15 years or more.
Domestication of dingoes has been difficult. Dingoes are intelligent animals. They are more independent and harder to train than other dogs.
Dingoes have larger canine teeth than domestic dogs.
Wild Australian dingoes kill and eat prey ranging in size from small lizards, birds and rodents up to sheep and kangaroos. They will also scavenge carrion.
The days of the pure dingo may be numbered. Dingoes are increasingly mating with feral domestic dogs. Some of the genetically purest dingoes live on Fraser Island in Queensland.
Evidence has emerged more recently of pure dingoes living close to Sydney.
Research at Sydney's University of New South Wales indicates dingoes may be the world's oldest breed of dog.
Dingoes breed once a year.
Australian dingoes mate in autumn.
Dingoes' gestation period is two months.
Dingoes produce one litter of pups each year.
Dingo litter sizes range between one and ten pups. The average number of pups born is five or six.
The dominant female dingo kills any pups born to other females in a dingo pack.
Pack members help care for the pups of the dominant dingo pair.
At around 8 weeks old, pups are weaned onto solid food, often consisting of regurgitated meat.

Offline Petermac

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #60 on: August 16, 2014, 09:30:28 AM »
Ok, so we've established that National Parks are there for the use of people, so let's dispense with the whole 'they were here before us' argument, because it's moot.

As you've pointed out, National Parks believes in conserving dingoes at Frazer. I'd contend that they are doing a very poor job of it, and that's impacting on peoples ability to visit and enjoy the island. As Nomad pointed out, once the brumbies were culled the problems really started as the food balance was lost. Now I'm not advocating for a second that the brumbies be retained - they certainly should have been removed - but we have a situation where an introduced animal (and there's no argument that they were introduced by humans, regardless of when) is looking to actively seek out and interact with humans because we are a food source. If the environment was in balance, as it was before that balance was interfered with by humans, we wouldn't be having this problem. Humans need to undo what has been done as they did with the brumbies. The attachment to dingoes is, in my view, misplaced and impacting the use of the island by the visitors who have a mandate to enjoy it.

Then again, Maybe I'm trying too hard to qualify an emotional argument. I can't visit Fraser with my kids for fear that they will be harmed by Dingoes. And that sucks.
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Offline Petermac

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #61 on: August 16, 2014, 09:34:44 AM »

Ask this question.. Do you go camping?? Or you and your family stay at home and watch TV..

Cause you can just go to any old bush camp and be bitten by a spider, snake or kicked by a cow and horse if you get to close.. So are we going to get rid of cows and horse's now because they are introduced??
So doesn't really matter where you camp theres a chance that a little one or adult can be hurt..

Wake up and smell the roses buddy we live in a country where there's dangerous animals everywhere..

Again, ignoring the argument. Spiders and snakes are endemic. And that's a stupid comment about cows and horses.

Stay at home watching TV?  I've camped all over this country. Try and stick to the facts instead of reverting to insults because you're incapable of making an educated argument.
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Offline Jeepers Creepers

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #62 on: August 16, 2014, 09:39:28 AM »
Wow. Now there's a clever argument.

My dear ol Dad, always said, never argue with an idiot, as no matter how wrong they might be, they'll never see it, as they are too busy to see past their own agenda.


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Offline Steffo1

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #63 on: August 16, 2014, 09:41:44 AM »
Ok, so we've established that National Parks are there for the use of people, so let's dispense with the whole 'they were here before us' argument, because it's moot.

As you've pointed out, National Parks believes in conserving dingoes at Frazer. I'd contend that they are doing a very poor job of it, and that's impacting on peoples ability to visit and enjoy the island. As Nomad pointed out, once the brumbies were culled the problems really started as the food balance was lost. Now I'm not advocating for a second that the brumbies be retained - they certainly should have been removed - but we have a situation where an introduced animal (and there's no argument that they were introduced by humans, regardless of when) is looking to actively seek out and interact with humans because we are a food source. If the environment was in balance, as it was before that balance was interfered with by humans, we wouldn't be having this problem. Humans need to undo what has been done as they did with the brumbies. The attachment to dingoes is, in my view, misplaced and impacting the use of the island by the visitors who have a mandate to enjoy it.

Then again, Maybe I'm trying too hard to qualify an emotional argument. I can't visit Fraser with my kids for fear that they will be harmed by Dingoes. And that sucks.
How do you transport the kiddies around. Surely not on public roads & especially the Bruce Highway section used to get to Fraser as it's regarded as the most deadly section of road in Qld.
Oh, better not let them swim in the ocean either!
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Offline Rumpig

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #64 on: August 16, 2014, 09:43:15 AM »
As you've pointed out, National Parks believes in conserving dingoes at Frazer. I'd contend that they are doing a very poor job of it, and that's impacting on peoples ability to visit and enjoy the island.
which people exactly are being effected....the drunken backpacker who can't find his way back to camp at night and passes out alone on a dune only to be awaken by a dingo nibbling on his foot, the young kid down by the barge landing point who wanders off alone whilst the parents are busy fishing or sitting in a vehicle reading a book, the guy walking alone on the beach at 10.30 p.m at night, the 2 young boys walking through a track without adult supervision, the asian lady sitting on the beach alone.......see a common theme appearing here at all do we?

Then again, Maybe I'm trying too hard to qualify an emotional argument. I can't visit Fraser with my kids for fear that they will be harmed by Dingoes. And that sucks.
as i wrote earlier.....educate yourself how the majority of attacks occurred and you'll see it's not hard to avoid those situations and enjoy Fraser Island as a beautiful place to visit ;)
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Offline Petermac

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #65 on: August 16, 2014, 09:44:03 AM »

my guess is your just writing that as bait, but if not here goes...more fool your wife for being paranoid something might  happen to the family and not just go there and take sensible precautions to try and be sure the family is safe (you can never rule anything out 100% from possibly happening), educate yourselves at how the majority of attacks have happened and you'll see a common theme appearing. Take sensible precautions whilst on the island and you'd likely have more chance of being involved in a car accident on your holiday then being "attacked" by dingos. Plenty of people enjoy going to Fraser Island (about 380 000 people a year last i read), so not sure what your point is with not being able to enjoy going to that National Park, it's just a choice your family seems to have made not to go there.
We have been taking our kids there and beach camping since they were both 6 months old, keep an eye on them and don't let them wander off alone (don't let young kids wander off together either, should have an adult present) and you shouldn't have a problem. For us and for many others the dingos are part of the attraction of Fraser Island, but we are smart enough to realise where we are and adapt to the conditions to make it as safe as we can for our family whilst there. Waking up in the morning and seeing fresh dingo foot prints in your camp is part of the Fraser attraction for us, and i'm sure many other people also.

Yes Rumpig, you're right and that was bait. But then I kinda got into the argument. On reflection I think you're right about taking caution with the kids, but I do need to get my wife across the line on the concept. She virtually grew up on Fraser as a kid when the dingoes were far less prominent than they are today. We were there a few years ago and we saw a dingo chase some kids into Lake McKenzie. I assume the kids were stirring it up, although I didn't see them doing it. But the dingoes from our observations are far more aggressive than they were 20 years ago, and that caused us to question going with little kids.
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Offline Rumpig

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #66 on: August 16, 2014, 09:47:30 AM »
We were there a few years ago and we saw a dingo chase some kids into Lake McKenzie. I assume the kids were stirring it up, although I didn't see them doing it.
which begs the question....and their parents were where?...obviously not looking after their kids properly on an island know for it's wild dogs.
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Offline wartim

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #67 on: August 16, 2014, 09:54:22 AM »
Here's some facts for you

Visitor numbers now stand at some 380,000 visitors per annum, with an average
length of stay of approximately 4 nights and which equates to approximately
1,500,000 bed nights (source: Fraser Coast South Burnett Tourism Association).
Vehicle numbers are approximately 70,000 per annum and these figures are certain
to rise.

Most dingo attacks on Fraser are the fault of the tourist doing something they know they shouldnt, so why blame the dingo -:
A 25-year-old man attacked by a pack of dingoes on Fraser Island had his clothes ripped from his body and rolled into a ball on the ground to protect himself, the veteran paramedic who treated him has said.
But Happy Valley ambulance officer Rod Macdonald leapt to the defence of the wild dogs, saying shortly after Monday’s night’s attack, the young victim conceded he should not have ventured beyond resort fencing to go to the beach in the dark.
The attack on Dane Allan, a chef at Fraser Island Retreat on the island’s eastern side, has once again sparked debate about dingo management on the island.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/fraser-island-dingoes-not-to-blame-says-paramedic-20140814-1049bh.html#ixzz3AVXvUuot

My wife and kids have visited this World Heritage Island of ours several times and  love the place.

Offline D4D

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #68 on: August 16, 2014, 09:57:55 AM »
I owe, I owe, it’s off to work I go…

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Offline wartim

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #69 on: August 16, 2014, 10:12:22 AM »
That's GOLD D4D and it is only yawning :cup: :cup: :cup:

Offline edz

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #70 on: August 16, 2014, 11:46:18 AM »
Cast and they will bite
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Offline Fathom

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #71 on: August 16, 2014, 05:07:26 PM »
Fraser is a terrible terrible place.
Dangerous to man, beast and vehicle.
I strongly urge everyone to stay away.
If you have even the most minor concern.
You are right.
Don't listen to the people telling you it's safe. Just stay away.


There that should get the beach to myself. :)
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Offline oldmate

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #72 on: August 16, 2014, 05:13:22 PM »
Fraser is a terrible terrible place.
Dangerous to man, beast and vehicle.
I strongly urge everyone to stay away.
If you have even the most minor concern.
You are right.
Don't listen to the people telling you it's safe. Just stay away.


There that should get the beach to myself. :)

Just you and D4D's dingo ;D
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Offline Fathom

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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #73 on: August 16, 2014, 05:16:16 PM »

Just you and D4D's dingo ;D
Pfft. That's just a little one.
I have  heard Australian native dingos can grow big enough to swallow a large twin axle caravan.
The place is dangerous I tell you. 
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Re: Dingo attack on Fraser
« Reply #74 on: August 16, 2014, 05:36:27 PM »
Pfft. That's just a little one.
I have  heard Australian native dingos can grow big enough to swallow a large twin axle caravan.
The place is dangerous I tell you.
by any chance, do you change character and structure on a full moon?