Author Topic: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything  (Read 779702 times)

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Marschy

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1850 on: April 16, 2015, 12:54:44 PM »
I agree that some of the Quad Racers just don't care, I was particularly concerned when I saw cars actually driving around, so I can only guess that the woolies was open still.  It seems that very little risk assessing went into it, hence the reason why model ac arent allowed to fly at night.  Some are actually trying to put some safety measures in place and I applaud those people.
There is a definite 'Too Cool For School" attitude among some of the quad racers on the ZMR250 thread on rcgroups. This is reflected in the user names that some of them give themselves. I asked the 'fatcnt' user a while back where he shot a video as it looked like a good location, but just got a flippant response.

This particular video was shot in the Woodcroft shopping centre carpark, south of Adelaide.

He certainly has a very "couldn't give a sh!t" attitude to other people's property. If he had a 'flyaway' he could have injured people walking around the carpark, flown into vehicles, or damaged other property at the shopping centre.

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1851 on: April 16, 2015, 12:55:49 PM »
Here's a video of my DYS motor not spinning up ... What do you guys think ?

I've sent it to Banggood for them to advise ..

www.lingeringlandscapes.com/Photos/motor problem .3gp
« Last Edit: April 16, 2015, 12:57:52 PM by Mandrake »
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Marschy

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1852 on: April 16, 2015, 01:00:46 PM »
Here's a video of my DYS motor not spinning up ... What do you guys think ?

I've sent it to Banggood for them to advise ..

www.lingeringlandscapes.com/Photos/motor problem .3gp

Have you tried another ESC?

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1853 on: April 16, 2015, 01:04:07 PM »
Not yet - I have to put pins on the ESC so will try that later ...
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1854 on: April 16, 2015, 01:20:16 PM »
Swapped a motor over onto the F450 and it spins straight away ... Thanks Mark - I should have done this myself earlier ...

So the Emax 4in1 is history ... Anyone want to play with it before I give it the heave ho ...
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Marschy

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1855 on: April 16, 2015, 01:24:34 PM »
Swapped a motor over onto the F450 and it spins straight away ... Thanks Mark - I should have done this myself earlier ...

So the Emax 4in1 is history ... Anyone want to play with it before I give it the heave ho ...
I've always been wary of the 4in1 ESC's. They don't leave any room for redundancy and not many of the brands have spares. I think the Qbrain and Quanum 4in1's do, not sure about the Emax. Plus the room they take up leaves only a few options when installing. Single ESC's on the other hand are much more versatile.

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1856 on: April 16, 2015, 02:16:09 PM »
Updated figures for the 6 props --

Prop             Material   Type   Weight     Thrust Max                 Thrust 50%

8" DJI           Plastic      8045  9gms       740gms/10Amps         260gms/3.5Amps
8" Unkn Tri   Plastic      8045  16gms     860gms/15Amps         275gms/4.0Amps
9" DJI           Plastic      9443  10gms     780gms/10Amps         270gms/3.9Amps
9" Unkn        CF            9443  14gms     660gms/8.4Amps        260gms/3.5Amps
9" Tri            Plastic      9045   17gms     600gms/10Amps        270gms/3.5Amps
10"Unkn      Plastic      1045   11gms      840gms/13.5Amps     300gms/4.0Amps
« Last Edit: April 16, 2015, 02:19:05 PM by Mandrake »
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1857 on: April 16, 2015, 04:31:17 PM »
Updated figures for the 6 props --

Prop             Material   Type   Weight     Thrust Max                 Thrust 50%

8" DJI           Plastic      8045  9gms       740gms/10Amps         260gms/3.5Amps
8" Unkn Tri   Plastic      8045  16gms     860gms/15Amps         275gms/4.0Amps
9" DJI           Plastic      9443  10gms     780gms/10Amps         270gms/3.9Amps
9" Unkn        CF            9443  14gms     660gms/8.4Amps        260gms/3.5Amps
9" Tri            Plastic      9045   17gms     600gms/10Amps        270gms/3.5Amps
10"Unkn      Plastic      1045   11gms      840gms/13.5Amps     300gms/4.0Amps

Hi,

Just my view, feel free to ignore or follow.  Others may have a differing view.

Is the Alien still around 1.6kg?  If so then you are going to need 400g / motor just to hover.  I think the 10" 10x4.5 are the best match in this case.  You'll be hovering at around 60% throttle, I reckon which is a little on the high side but should be ok as long you dont expect it to drive like a Ferrari.  Reason for not choosing the tri's blades is that you'll be spending a lot of your time in the 60% to 80% throttle range.  For a whole extra 20g of lift per motor you loose 1.5A (I'd say they'd use an extra .75A to 1A at 80% throttle), that will reduce your flight time and the extra 80g in the grand scheme of things will only be a mild help.

Good news is that at 840g / motor you get a 2:1 thrust ratio at 100% power!  Just where you want and need to be.

Hope it helps.

Chris
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Offline CBRK

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1858 on: April 16, 2015, 04:43:41 PM »
There is a definite 'Too Cool For School" attitude among some of the quad racers on the ZMR250 thread on rcgroups. This is reflected in the user names that some of them give themselves. I asked the 'fatcnt' user a while back where he shot a video as it looked like a good location, but just got a flippant response.

This particular video was shot in the Woodcroft shopping centre carpark, south of Adelaide.

He certainly has a very "couldn't give a sh!t" attitude to other people's property. If he had a 'flyaway' he could have injured people walking around the carpark, flown into vehicles, or damaged other property at the shopping centre.

Yep there are some threads I figure I'll just stay out of, I rarely look at that one.  It's sad that they don't realise the implications of what they are doing, not only to them but to others.  If they can find a safe place to do it, ie indoors in a controlled location (ie: nets to keep people out).  I wonder how many of them have seen what a prop does to a person if they hit someone.  I bet if you ask them they'd say they were safe the other night at the woolies.  I strongly disagree with them, sadly laws are only followed by law abiding citizens and the rest just do what they and and complain when they get in trouble.

I remember the clip of the Canadian film / photography crew and then suddenly it flies in to the car in the car park.  People were claiming, oh there's no way that octo did that much damage to the car.  If I recall correctly, it wrote the car off, that's several thousands of dollars of damage.  Imagine if that was a person, it could be $100,000's in medical bills.

I bet he doesn't have public liability insurance for it, and if he does and I was the insurance provider, I'd be saying well we don't cover 'stupid', your on your own sunshine.  Then the poor person who was hit is out of pocket because he'll just declare bankruptcy.

His handle says it all, I wonder if he's just trying to get a rise out of people with the name or thinks he's clever.  You'd think the mod's would look at the name and go, hmmmm, you are trying to say something which people may find offensive, we should get that changed or suspended.

Unfortunately since the costs have come down more people are getting into it.  It is fun after all, it's just that they need to understand the local shops isnt the local racetrack.....

Chris
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1859 on: April 16, 2015, 06:59:53 PM »
Hi,

Just my view, feel free to ignore or follow.  Others may have a differing view.

Is the Alien still around 1.6kg?  If so then you are going to need 400g / motor just to hover.  I think the 10" 10x4.5 are the best match in this case.  You'll be hovering at around 60% throttle, I reckon which is a little on the high side but should be ok as long you dont expect it to drive like a Ferrari.  Reason for not choosing the tri's blades is that you'll be spending a lot of your time in the 60% to 80% throttle range.  For a whole extra 20g of lift per motor you loose 1.5A (I'd say they'd use an extra .75A to 1A at 80% throttle), that will reduce your flight time and the extra 80g in the grand scheme of things will only be a mild help.

Good news is that at 840g / motor you get a 2:1 thrust ratio at 100% power!  Just where you want and need to be.

Hope it helps.

Chris

Just did a rough weigh of the Alien bits - 1.8 Kg... Without gimbal and camera it's around the 1.5 Kg mark - The 6 bandy legs might have to go in favour of its own 4 CF legs

Still wondering about which FC to use in it too . Don't want to fork out for a DJI GPS but might have to ... I guess the question is - Do I really want/need 4 flying machines ?? I really like the Phantoms so I think I'll put the APM into the Alien - Yep decision made !! The F450 can wait for its GPS until I get my pension ..LOL .
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1860 on: April 17, 2015, 09:51:10 AM »
Just did a rough weigh of the Alien bits - 1.8 Kg... Without gimbal and camera it's around the 1.5 Kg mark - The 6 bandy legs might have to go in favour of its own 4 CF legs

Still wondering about which FC to use in it too . Don't want to fork out for a DJI GPS but might have to ... I guess the question is - Do I really want/need 4 flying machines ?? I really like the Phantoms so I think I'll put the APM into the Alien - Yep decision made !! The F450 can wait for its GPS until I get my pension ..LOL .

Hi,

You'll still have 1.8:1 lift to weight ratio, which is acceptable, you just wont be able to treat it like a sports car.  If you can easily lighten it then I'd go for it but at the end of the day it will be a cost benefit analysis ( plus losing valuable flying time :-) ).

You made the right choice on the FC I reckon!  You can never have to many.  I have in flying condition a Tricopter, the mini quad and a Bixler 2.  I have a damaged nitro trainer and a partially build 4 star 40 (I'll convert this to electric).  I'm about to add for a competition I'm entering into with a group of people a UAV frame (likely to be a custom build) and a VTOL (likely to be a custom tilt rotor design - think Osprey).  You can never have to many flying things :-)  Sadly my wife thinks otherwise....  All I can say is i'm lucky I have a large walk in storage space under my house (that and my wife's stuff occupies about 60% of it so I'm good till she starts clearing stuff, I only use 25% at most).  I'd be screwed otherwise  ;D

Chris
« Last Edit: April 17, 2015, 10:56:11 AM by CBRK »
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1861 on: April 18, 2015, 06:41:05 PM »
Grrr, my thrust tester is too small for the 15" props.....  I will just put them on the tri and see if it feels better.  I'll try to modify the thrust meter in the next few weeks (data will follow once I've tested it).  Cant believe it didn't fit, it was out by about 1.5 cm's.  I dont think when I build it that I was even contemplating 15" props.

Chris
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1862 on: April 18, 2015, 07:15:36 PM »
I started on the Alien re-build today and put the new DYS motors on .. Found out real quick what was wrong the other day - Same as last time the screws supplied are about 2mm too long and start to bite into the motor windings BUT only on the motors with black nuts ( CW ?? ) - So I added a couple of fibre washers between the motor and the motor holder and we're good to go ... Banggood very kindly told me that my video indicated the motors were shot so they are sending the order again - Bonus now ... So I'll have enough motors spare to make an octocopter !! LOL ..
Anyway the FPV and OSD are wired in and mounted on the Alien's lid - QBrain and Naza are about to be tested - then I have to wait for a GPS module to arrive to complete the build .. Not sure what to do next week as the weather is going to be crap .. Probably go shopping for an octo frame LOL - NO !!! Housework says my missus ...
Maybe some pics tomorrow ...
Going back to basics - sort of ...

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1863 on: April 19, 2015, 12:53:13 AM »

Grrr, my thrust tester is too small for the 15" props.....  I will just put them on the tri and see if it feels better.  I'll try to modify the thrust meter in the next few weeks (data will follow once I've tested it).  Cant believe it didn't fit, it was out by about 1.5 cm's.  I dont think when I build it that I was even contemplating 15" props.

Chris
over hang the bench to test it.
Regards
Crispy


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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1864 on: April 19, 2015, 12:57:32 AM »

.. Not sure what to do next week as the weather is going to be crap ..
Maybe some pics tomorrow ...
Me neither we will be in Salzburg and Venice before spending the next week or so in Rome. We'll I guess when in Rome...............
Regards
Crispy


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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1865 on: April 24, 2015, 10:57:40 AM »
OK - I have had it with this APM 2.6 thing ... Its for sale ... APM 2.6 , GPS , 915Mhz 3DR - Best Offer bought for $100 AUD ..
http://www.aliexpress.com/snapshot/6535416230.html?orderId=66183809598660

Going to stick with what I understand Naza M ....

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Cheers

Steve
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1866 on: April 24, 2015, 12:40:23 PM »
OK - I have had it with this APM 2.6 thing ... Its for sale ... APM 2.6 , GPS , 915Mhz 3DR - Best Offer bought for $100 AUD ..
http://www.aliexpress.com/snapshot/6535416230.html?orderId=66183809598660

Going to stick with what I understand Naza M ....

Send PM if you want it --

Cheers

Steve

What happened?
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1867 on: April 24, 2015, 12:48:04 PM »
don't know exactly but It wants to fly where I don't want to .. SO enough is enough -- Naza is idiotproof enough for this idiot so I'm sticking to what I understand and can fix easily ...
Man's gotta know his limitations !!!
Already pulled it apart ready to  ship to anyone that wants it...

Fitted a Naza Lite (M) upgraded and it works ...

So on with the Alien powered by Naza M...
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1868 on: April 24, 2015, 12:49:24 PM »
don't know exactly but It wants to fly where I don't want to .. SO enough is enough -- Naza is idiotproof enough for this idiot so I'm sticking to what I understand and can fix easily ...
Man's gotta know his limitations !!!
Already pulled it apart ready to  ship to anyone that wants it...

Fitted a Naza Lite (M) upgraded and it works ...

So on with the Alien powered by Naza M...

Fair enough, as long as it gets you flying and having fun that is the main thing.
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1869 on: April 30, 2015, 02:06:38 PM »
The new DJI Phantom 3 Pro looks good ........

yogi

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1870 on: May 04, 2015, 12:41:39 PM »
Finally, sunshine is forecast for nearly the whole week!!!!  Been a weird 2 weeks, definitely had a bad week to be my areas Duty Officer (would have been oh so nice to have a weekend, oh well).  The other nights I've been out in a truck, going to work, spending a few hours with the family and then the rest being sleep (I've been a bit of a zombie the last few days).  So I've not progressed at all on any of my projects, good news is that I've had a bunch of stuff that I ordered last month arrive so I have lots of 'stuff' to play with.

You'll laugh Mark but you were right HK sent me the wrong bits a 2nd time.  Its taken me 3 weeks for them to realise that it's a stuff up on their labelling at the warehouse and that I was trying to help them (and not effect other customers).  Their only solution to getting me the right part was to refund the money, wait a week (and hope they had fixed the issue) and order again.  When I asked about the P&H costs, they refused to refund it - despite this issue not being my fault at all.  So currently all HK ordering is on hold with me.  They are appealing to management after I suggested they check out how much I'm spending with them at present and did they really want to lose me as a customer....  Say no to refunding me $15 of P&H and I say no to spending more money.  I also have the UAV Challenge - Medical Express competition which will be several thousands in various of bits (although they would only get a small amount of the items).  Ball is in their court.

Having said that it has made me buy more from other vendors now, I just have to get used to ordering earlier.  Whats funny is a APM power distribution board I bought from HK gets hot on 3s and burnt out the 12V reg on 4s (it's rated to 6s), the one I got from aliexpress is cooler on 4s than the HK on 3s......  So not sure what HK have done to their board.....

Before the weather went all funky, I was getting in some good flying time, I think my emax motors are up to nearly 4 hours of flight time.  So far all good.  I have my 15" props to test out on it, hoping for a quick flight on Wednesday afternoon.

Anyone got a good supplier for LiPO batteries besides HK.....  I can see myself picking up another couple of 4s batteries. 

Chris
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1871 on: May 04, 2015, 12:56:03 PM »
I have a couple from Aliexpress 3S - brand is Lion Power - they seem OK .
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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1872 on: May 04, 2015, 04:44:32 PM »
Here's my latest project - Finally found a small toolbox at Bunnings for 4 bucks to house it all ...

Then you mount it on the tripod and connect the antenna and battery and switch on the DVR...tanah..
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 04:47:10 PM by Mandrake »
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Marschy

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1873 on: May 04, 2015, 08:10:17 PM »
Here's my latest project - Finally found a small toolbox at Bunnings for 4 bucks to house it all ...

Then you mount it on the tripod and connect the antenna and battery and switch on the DVR...tanah..

That looks the goods Steve. I need to do something similar.

Chris, Hobbyking don't give a crap if they stuff up your order. If they lose you or I, another dozen customers step up to the plate on a daily basis.

OCD has got the better of me of late. I've been helping my brother with his van and also sorting out the solar panels on mine. One of my panels looks like it took a hard knock where it was permanently mounted on the roof and it smashed the tempered glass and when it shorted out, the other panel connected in parallel also shorted out. It looks as though the bus wire has melted when it shorted on the panel that isn't smashed, so I've ordered some bus wire from Aliexpress for 10 bucks that comes with 40 B grade 0.5 volt cells. I'm going to have a go at repairing the panel that shorted out, and if it works it will go on the shed roof to trickle charge the vans batteries. If it doesn't work, eh, 10 bucks, worth a shot.

But the APM Arduino software has opened my eye's to other projects. I am currently designing a solar panel mount that will fit on the rear of my van the will be raised using a linear ball screw and high torque stepper motor using an Arduino to control everything.

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Re: Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything
« Reply #1874 on: May 06, 2015, 08:31:14 AM »
Well after mucking around getting everything going on the 350QX I have just ordered a complete system from DJI .... How do you find your Phantom Mandrake ?

Thanks
yogi

PS(I will still be playing with my other quads but this new Phantom 3 Pro is a camera only platform)
« Last Edit: May 06, 2015, 08:36:09 AM by yogi »