Remote controlled flying things-Quads, Hex, Octo or anything

[WilSurf]

Not fair, no Aldi in Adelaide.

I am sure there is a BigW in Adelaide. They have exactly the same, branded 3Sixt.

[CBRK]

Pretty much where I'm at the moment. I'm waiting on a couple of metres of servo wire and crimp connectors to make my own leads for APM to receiver. I still have the splitter cable for Telemetry/OSD/APM, but the shipment with the servo wire also has yet another minimOSD after I stuffed up my second one. So I'm waiting, waiting, waiting.

I managed to get the OSD working with my first board, then I attempted the dreaded voltage monitor modification for the MultiWii at which point it fell into a pile of do do. However with that board I had the 5 volt pads soldered, and the PAL pad as well, and also removed the 'APWR' diode. That all worked sweet. Then after I stuffed up the board by bridging terminals on the ATMEGA chip, the second board I removed the 'APWR' diode, and the board never worked from the get go after I removed the diode. The second board also came with the analog and digital sides of the board already soldered together!!!!!

I'm waiting on another minimOSD board that has been in Australia since the 6th August, but the tracking has not progressed any further since.

I've got the 2.6 board, but from what I understand, these two boards are pretty much the same, but the I2C port is closer to the GPS port on the 2.7 board so the GPS and compass can be plugged in close together.

Please keep testing and posting your results. I'll catch up soon.

Hi Marschy,

I know that feeling!  I'll keep updating, hoping to get some good stable footage soon from it.  The gopro gimbal arrived, need to be confident in it before I strap a $450 camera to it.  I most likely will put the cheaper action cam on to test it out but that is a near the end of the month addition, so much to do, so little time.

One of the benefits of the HKPilot 2.7 board is that it has the additional I2C port supposedly defaulted to an additional OSD.  It's located where the old GPS port was (right next to the power input).  This means that the minim board can transmit to the APM board and not rely on a piggybacked signal from the telemetry radios, so if the telemetry radios go offline you can still receive your OSD, as there have been a few reported instances where this has happened (and it looks tidier).  Haven't been able to get it to work so far - but i will, just a matter of when :-). 

I plan to just wire up the new minimOSD board in the piggybacked config to make it simpler for the short term - I need to have it fully tested for my Fraser Island trip in September.

Less than a month to go now!  Hard bit will be trying to pack the tricopter in for the trip.  My little girl's stuff now takes up so much room.

Cant believe I ever got out of RC flying years ago, what was I thinking!  I plan to pick up a Bixler once I get back from Fraser - just too many things to do before hand.  Plus the wife will shoot me if I bought even more RC stuff right now.  Best thing is that the hobby now joins my electronics interest with it, 15 years ago it was all really basic stuff unless you spent heaps, not to mention with the APM board it links into my programming skills too.

I ordered the sonar on the weekend, not sure when I'll find time to incorporate that one.  Might be a when I return from Fraser, although it would be nice to have a sonar for landing.

Regards,

Chris

[Marschy]

Got the replacement minimOSD. This time, no mucking around, no soldering stuff, just reloaded the bootstrapper using my USBasp, then reloaded the firmware using the serial to usb adapter (whatever it's called), updated the character set, and BINGO.

[CBRK]

Got the replacement minimOSD. This time, no mucking around, no soldering stuff, just reloaded the bootstrapper using my USBasp, then reloaded the firmware using the serial to usb adapter (whatever it's called), updated the character set, and BINGO.

Nice one Marschy!

I got my replacement too but between SES, work and family it's been sitting on my bench.......  I was reading last night through that another person has had similar issues about the start up (not allowing you to arm), it seems that two wires maybe swapped on the cable for some reason (seems to be a HKPilot 2.7 and HK supplied cable).  So I will be checking that out tonight in a bid to get mine working.

Also the sonar arrived as well, reading up on it, all I have to do is mount it, plug it in and configure it.  The configure steps look easy so I might do that tonight.

On a sad note i've killed my 2nd LiPO battery, the transmitter was left on (dont monkey with stuff in the early am) and it now has killed one of the cells, a 3s reports as a 2s with a deeply degraded 2nd cell, so not good.  I thought it had over discharge protection but turns out its the other transmitter battery that has that  .  More batteries to be ordered now  .  I think I'll switch to LiFE for the transmitter as I've read they shouldnt die if I leave it on.

So this weeks HK order will be:
2 x LiFE Transmitter batteries (1 to replace the dead lipo and 1 extra)
2 x 3s 2200mah batteries (1 to replace, plus an extra)

You can never have to many batteries 

[Marschy]

Nice one Marschy!

I got my replacement too but between SES, work and family it's been sitting on my bench.......  I was reading last night through that another person has had similar issues about the start up (not allowing you to arm), it seems that two wires maybe swapped on the cable for some reason (seems to be a HKPilot 2.7 and HK supplied cable).  So I will be checking that out tonight in a bid to get mine working.

Also the sonar arrived as well, reading up on it, all I have to do is mount it, plug it in and configure it.  The configure steps look easy so I might do that tonight.

On a sad note i've killed my 2nd LiPO battery, the transmitter was left on (dont monkey with stuff in the early am) and it now has killed one of the cells, a 3s reports as a 2s with a deeply degraded 2nd cell, so not good.  I thought it had over discharge protection but turns out its the other transmitter battery that has that  .  More batteries to be ordered now  .  I think I'll switch to LiFE for the transmitter as I've read they shouldnt die if I leave it on.

So this weeks HK order will be:
2 x LiFE Transmitter batteries (1 to replace the dead lipo and 1 extra)
2 x 3s 2200mah batteries (1 to replace, plus an extra)

You can never have to many batteries 

I've run down one of my batteries below 3.1 volts on a couple of occasions.

If you use a dumb charger you can get it above 3.1 again, then throw it on the smart charger to balance it. I've done this a couple of times now where I haven't had a low battery alarm attached while I'm setting up the quad, so I haven't been running the motors or causing any other large current draw from the batteries and the battery has gone below the recommended low voltage.

When setting up the flight controller, you notice it falls below the minimum voltage because things stop working, like your receiver or GPS will stop working. My battery wasn't showing signs of overheating when it ran low or put on the dumb charger, so it should be ok. Time will tell.

Calculated risk, I know.

What sonar did you get?

[CBRK]

I've run down one of my batteries below 3.1 volts on a couple of occasions.

If you use a dumb charger you can get it above 3.1 again, then throw it on the smart charger to balance it. I've done this a couple of times now where I haven't had a low battery alarm attached while I'm setting up the quad, so I haven't been running the motors or causing any other large current draw from the batteries and the battery has gone below the recommended low voltage.

When setting up the flight controller, you notice it falls below the minimum voltage because things stop working, like your receiver or GPS will stop working. My battery wasn't showing signs of overheating when it ran low or put on the dumb charger, so it should be ok. Time will tell.

Calculated risk, I know.

What sonar did you get?

I think it's dead dead, one of the cells doesn't register at all, one is getting 2.7 and the other is around 1.75.  It was interesting my cell checker reports it as a 2s, despite it being in the 3s plug - I had to check that it was a 3 cell battery, it had me stumped.  I think it's gone but I might try the dump charger outside where it cant do any damage if it goes wrong....  Not sure I'd ever trust the battery in the future so it may not be worthwhile doing.

On the sonar I used the one from HK (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__43427__Ultrasonic_Module_HC_SR04_Arduino_AUS_Warehouse_.html), for $3.31 I couldn't resist, I was expecting like $15 or $20 for it and once I realised it was that low it was a no brainer.  Looks like I just plug it into A0 and then just enable in MP.  Hoping this will be as easy as the Power Module to install :-).  It might be slightly harder as I have to find a spot to stick it to but that should be easy.

Then heights below 5m will be using it as the ALT sensor, which is handy if the terrain isnt flat, like going up a hill and you want to use ALT hold (say 4m).

I did do a really quick test of the minimOSD the other night and it does the booting up bit then it flashes an OSD screen and then goes back to booting up again and then sits there forever....  I only had 5 to 10 mins to spare and didnt expect to get much happening in that time.  Tonight if my little girl is over her cold then she'll sleep through and I wont need to get up every 10 mins to settle her.

[Marschy]

The HC-SR04 is the one I have as well. The little bit of reading I have done suggests setting it's limit to 2 metres and allowing the barometer to work out the altitude above that.

[CBRK]

The HC-SR04 is the one I have as well. The little bit of reading I have done suggests setting it's limit to 2 metres and allowing the barometer to work out the altitude above that.

Grrr, now I read the same that most arent getting the full 5m out of it, closer to 3.5m max with APM saying take 60% of that.... Sigh, why do I see these things afterwards.  So basically it'll be there only in the event that I really stuff up then, or for really low level flights, right about head chopping head wonderful....

[Marschy]

Grrr, now I read the same that most arent getting the full 5m out of it, closer to 3.5m max with APM saying take 60% of that.... Sigh, why do I see these things afterwards.  So basically it'll be there only in the event that I really stuff up then, or for really low level flights, right about head chopping head wonderful....

Realistically, I only wanted to get one to help with landing. So 2 metres range will work I reckon.

I reckon the good thing about the APM platform is you can spend as little $$ as you want or as much as you want. You can get the 3DRobitics Sonar for $90 or around that mark. It's much more accurate than the HC-SR04, but you get what you pay for. For around $5 the HC-SR04 will do me fine. If it makes my landings look any better than what mine currently do, I'll be more than happy.

[Marschy]

The 3DRRadio is working from my desktop PC and MinimOSD is working as well. Still working out how to connect the 3DRRadio to my tablet.

[Marschy]

Sorted, just unplugged my OTG cable from my nexus, started Droidplanner, reconnect the OTG cable and the radio and it works. Cool, almost there, just have to do the wiring for the receiver and motors, then I'm ready to do the final tune then fly.

[Marschy]

Almost there now, just got to put a few more cable ties on to hold the ESC's on properly, then I'm ready for tuning, then flying.

This is my complete setup for the F450 quadcopter frame with APM 2.6 flight controller and NEO 6M GPS.



I've changed my radio over from mode 1 to mode 2 by swapping the gimbals over so I can have a shot at 'Drift' mode. Pretty simple to do, took about 1 hour. Not too happy with how easy the OSD is to read on the Fatshark Dominator goggles, actually not overly thrilled with the goggles at all to be frank. I've order a 7 inch monitor, so I'll be able to see which I prefer. I've got to find a way to secure the 3DRRadio receiver which is just hanging down at the moment from the tablet OTG cable. I should be able to secure it in a similar way to the remote antenna I have for the flight radio transmitter which uses the frame for holding my tablet to secure the remote antenna.

There is a lot of kit on these things when you break it all down.



On this side the red LED on the right side of the picture is the satellite receiver, the red LED's in the middle are the MinimOSD sandwiched above the 3DRRadio transmitter with the dipole antenna hanging down.



Here you can see the FPV camera transmitter with it's circular polarised antenna, and above it the 9 channel OrangeRX receiver. Above it is a capacitor to help stop receiver 'brownouts' due to voltage spikes. I used the nozzle off a Mortein insect spray can to feed the receiver antenna through, otherwise you're left with a loose piece of antenna wire flapping around. You could probably use a chupa chup stick as well. It's all very DIY putting these things together so getting everything nice and neat and tidy is a challenge.



I've made a connector to allow two 3 cell 2200 mAh batteries to be connected in parallel to give me 4400 mAh. That feeds into the power module then the flight control board sandwiched right in the guts of the copter.



And finally, the gimbal with GoPro knockoff camera on the front, and the FPV camera above that.

I'm charging all of my flight batteries tonight in anticipation of a flight tomorrow.

[CBRK]

Hi Marschy,

Very jealous, you've gone pretty far in that time :-)

I've got my MinimOSD and Telemetry working together, turns out I had to move 3 pins on the piggyback connector.  I was lucky I had the working telemetry cable by itself to compare the piggyback cable.  So I've moved those and it seems good, board starts up properly now and I can arm it.  It's nice isnt it to not need to connect with the usb cable.  Note that it's still needed for the pulling logs off, I found that out on the flight that didnt go so well.

Tomorrow I'll try to enable the OSD and mount it, without the camera....  Will be interesting to see if that works.  Will be interesting to see if the rain lets me (I'm the SES duty officer for my area this week, and Sydney's due for some heavy rain and strong winds).  Was kinda hoping I'd be able to do a flight today but I doubt that will happen.

I burnt a camera yesterday, not happy with myself right now.  So I've order two more just in case.  This just took the mistake tax up another $50.  I forgot that the Boscam vTx passes the voltage through, which was great while I was powering it all with a 2S LiFE battery.  I thought I'd power it off the main battery and forgot that I had a UBEC to keep the voltage at the happy 5v for the camera (I got the UBEC specifically for this).  I can say the camera doesnt like 12v, no magic smoke, just a dim red light teasing me......  It normally has a bright red light.  For some reason late last night I thought it was like the immersionRC which does do a regulated 5v supply.  One of cameras is a replacement for the same PilotHD (I like have a small 720p with a microSD card slot - even if it isnt perfect in light balance, etc) the other is the camera recommended earlier (it takes 12v so I will run it without the UBEC).  So tonight was wiring up the harness to include the UBEC as a module (the number of servo connectors I'm going through is amazing).  Works nicely (as far as my multimeter is concerned), would be nice to have a camera to test it with.  Ready to mount it on the frame tomorrow.

Nice pics, it's inspired me, I'll take some tomorrow, if time permits.  Yours is looking like mine, very little free space left :-)  Although yours is looking very tidy and professional, mine has that home built look, cables not perfect but getting better..  Love the fact you've used colour coded zip ties.

Interesting that you have the tablet doing the telmetry mounted there, I have my monitor for FPV in that spot.  Although if I had it there last time I would have known what was happening......

Soon as I get my new camera I should be at the same stage.  Fingers crossed it will arrive next week.  I will try to get a flight in before work next week.  I'm thinking my next flight will be with a tether until I trust it not to RTL if it's out of the geofence area.

I've been reading up on the sonar we have, seems that we have some work ahead of us.  It's not a simple plug and play for this sonar.  So it looks like it'll have to wait till after Fraser.  I'll most likely mod it to become a plug and play with a small arduino add on board so that it gives the same data as the plug and play sonars.  I'm thinking of getting a sonar that is plug and play for the short term and then work on the other one in my spare time.  Wow at $35+ plug and play sonars are expensive little beasts.

I'll order one next pay and hope it arrives in time before I leave...

Chris

[CBRK]

Sorted, just unplugged my OTG cable from my nexus, started Droidplanner, reconnect the OTG cable and the radio and it works. Cool, almost there, just have to do the wiring for the receiver and motors, then I'm ready to do the final tune then fly.

If its an android tab and if you use multiple apps, I have DroidPlanner 1 & 2, and ardupilot installed.  You'll need to disconnect the OTG cable and reconnect once the application is open as it ties the connection to the application.  In my case since I have all those apps I do a choose each time as to which app will use the connection, remember you cant just switch from one to the next easily, you have to unplug and replug it in again.  Hope it didnt take too long to work that one out, it took me an 30+ mins to work that one out.

[Marschy]

My burntout components list now totals

2 x minimosd boards
1 x 9 channel OrangeRX receiver that I connected straight to my battery (only likes 6 volts max). That was fun, lots of smoke. Good thing I had a couple for building my other quads.

Thanks for the tip, got the 3DRRadio receiver working. I plugged everything in this morning and the OSD is not working due to a loose connection somewhere, but I'm thinking if it's going to be flakey, I may do away with it and just use the 3DRRadio telemetry. I'm always going to have my tablet with me anyway. I bought a heap of servo connectors, so I'm going to change the connectors over to the new ones, and crimp and solder all connectors so these sort of problems go away. If that doesn't work and the OSD plays up with its connection from time to time, I'll ditch the OSD. Better to have the FPV camera work all the time without stuffing around with the OSD.

[Marschy]

I didn't get to do much more that trim the pitch, roll and yaw today. Trying to get the channel 7 tuning working, but it is not working for me. I'll keep trying.

Sparkfun website sells all of the recommended 3DRobitics sonars, bit dearer than 3DRRobitics website, but shipping is a lot less. You can get an LV-EZ4 for $27.95 US and international Economy shipping $2.72. Look in the sensor section under 'proximity'.

3DRRobitics shipping is outrageous, it's dearer than the actual sonar. Even worse is the Maxbotics web site who make the sonars.

[CBRK]

Hi,

Since Marschy did such a good job of showing us where he's up to, he inspired me to do the same.

So this is my tricopter:


It consists of 7mm ply wood for the plates and 12mm x 12mm pine for three booms.  I'm using the DT750 motors with 10x4.5 props.  Seems to have plenty of power.  It's based upon the rcexplorer.se tricopter (v2.5)

I typically power it using a 3s 2200mah battery but I also use 3s 5000mah for when I want a longer flight time.  On the KK2 board I was getting 12 - 14 mins on the 2200 and about 20-22 mins on the 5000.  Now that I'm using the HKPilot 2.7 board I'm expecting this to go down as I'm now powering my camera and OSD through the main battery, and the APM board I think will be a bit more hungry (I have telemetry and GPS that my KK2 config didnt have).  Those times were with an action cam mounted on the front instead of the PilotHD.  I am building my Go Pro mount this week and plan to mount it onto the frame.

Can you spot the minumOSD tucked away:


It's tucked away with the custom harness I made.  Hoping it will work when I get my replacement camera this week.

My radio and monitor:


I've just got a basic Turnigy 9x (running stock firmware), I plan to upgrade to the 9XR soon.

My yaw control:


My telemetry on PC (use my phone or tab when out and about):


This was one part that was easy for the PC, took 30 mins to work out how to hook up to the Android tablet.

Now that I've got every thing working (minus the camera) I'm hoping that I'll get a break one of the days before work this week and give it a test flight.  The KK2 board worked well and I can switch back to it easily as the tray on top can be swapped for the KK2.  Really looking forward to testing out this APM board.  It looked so graceful on the last test flight, until the failsafe kicked in.

I cant say it enough, this gear is not plug and play.....  Just about everything needed some tweaking.  The only part that was really plug and play was the power module.  I've had to switch wires for the external compass, I've had to cut the GPS from 6 pins to 5 pins and I've had to move wires on the OSD telemtry piggy back cable. 

I've also built a custom harness for the MinimOSD to work.

I need to feel confident that it will fly how I want so I can take it to Fraser with me in the next couple of weeks.

One of the mainstream providers would do so well like HK if they did this for you, even if you buy the kits you still need to tweak this stuff, absolutely crazy.  If you didn't have basic electronics skills you'd be stuffed, you'd give up.

Chris

[Marschy]

Hello Chris, if at some stage you are looking at tidying up the wiring, then consider putting some of this stuff on your shopping list.



The mesh works as well, but the problem with the mesh is that the ends need to have heat shrink put over it to secure the end of the mesh to stop it from unravelling.

The spiral wrap tubing is more versatile, because if you need to, you can remove it and reuse it. The mesh is remove and bin. This stuff makes the job so much tidier.

The 9XR is a good radio, more so with the accessories they flog it off with as well. Plus, as I have already done myself, you can swap between mode 1 and 2. I've reflashed mine with OpenTx, which is used by other open source radio's like the Taranis which is a logical radio to move onto if I need something with more grunt than the 9XR. And if I do move on, then at least the firmware is familiar.

[edz]

How long till this happens I wonder http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread907188/pg1

[CBRK]

How long till this happens I wonder http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread907188/pg1

Hopefully it won't happen here, some people do strange things (each to there own though).

People have been using airsoft (bb guns) and fire crackers off multirotors for a while (in US and Europe).  For the firecrackers they use a remote channel to light them and then they have wait for it to finish.  Luckily guns weigh a lot generally so I dont think it will be something that people do a lot, even in the US which has a very vocal gun crazy group.  Although to my knowledge this has been done a few times over there.

Here in Aus it would be a lot harder to do, it would be a very quick way to loose your firearms license as I'm pretty sure this would breach many of the conditions.

[Marschy]

Pretty sure the guy is breaking US FAA laws as well. The guy obviously doesn't want to be identified. No different to mounting a gun on the fender of your car or the handlebars of your pushbike.

[CBRK]

Pretty sure the guy is breaking US FAA laws as well. The guy obviously doesn't want to be identified. No different to mounting a gun on the fender of your car or the handlebars of your pushbike.

I'd agree with that, It would more likely be state or county laws than federal laws though.  I'm sure there'd be a few federal laws that would help too.

I'm not sure if any of the ones I've seen of guns mounted on a multicopter have ever had the firearm discharged, I'm thinking that the FC would have a hell of a time counteracting it and not letting it fall out of the sky.

The only question I have is: WHY?

What is wrong with people.....  Cameras make sense as we want to see pictures from up there, but a gun, can only mean he wants to use it surely?

[Marschy]

I'm thinking that the FC would have a hell of a time counteracting it and not letting it fall out of the sky.

It could be used in place of FLIP flightmode 

It's going to happen one day though. Lets face it, some crackpot is going to use one as a means for delivering a lethal payload one day. Most likely something that blows up, more so than a firearm.

May as well fly quad's while the sun shines, I reckon the US will have an incident either from a domestic or foreign threat and it will be all over for quadcopters and possibly fixed wing RC models as well. Long range FPV systems are already capable of 10+ km range, this puts a perpetrator well away from the scene of the incident with a good head start to get the hell of out Dodge and all done anonymously and autonomously.

 

[Marschy]

Just read on fpvlab that the ban on FPV by the FAA includes autopilot systems as well.

[Marschy]

Haven't had a chance to get out and fly today, few jobs around the house were begging to be done, so all I've done this week is have a go at making my own clover leaf antenna for the next quad.



It turned out very well. I used brass standoffs that are used for mounting computer motherboards which are ideal for soldering the wire to. They have been ground down to about 4mm and because the standoff is a hex shape, when drilled with a 1mm drill every second face of the hex nut, gives you a good reference for each petal of the antenna to be 120 degrees from the next.



The SMA connector from Jaycar is a ripoff at $5.95. I ordered a metre of RG316 coax months ago for next to nothing off ebay. The next lot of SMA's I'll order from ebay which you can get for around a buck a piece.

I'm certainly not going to buy 5.8gHz antennas anymore when you can make them so cheaply if you already have a heap of old 240 volt cable with 1mm copper wire. I reckon I should be able to knock these up for about $3/each.

Edit: Finished making the 4 petal clover leaf antenna for the receiver today. Works like a bought one.



Very impressed with the 700tvl CCD camera. The image is very sharp in full sunlight, bit grainy in low light, but again much better than the Pilot HD and half the price. The Pilot HD was originally going to go on the F450, but I've put the 700tvl camera on there now. So I've ordered another for the Alien quad.