Question for the local law enforcers

[Footy Shorts Shane]

A few years ago there were stories of cars being defected on trailers as they left a race track here in Qld. "Apparantly" as they left the track, on trailers, they were pulled over and defected for items like tyres, nitrous oxide etc, as they were registered and had the plates on them. Initially I called bull****. If it's on a truck or trailer, surely it's classed as a load, not a vehicle. However, if it is registered, possibly it should be in a road worthy condition if the plates are fitted?
I take cars like this to the track almost monthly as part of my work, so this obviously interested me. So I called the local police station, explained what apparently happened and asked if the vehicle can be defected on a trailer. First guy say's "Dunno. I'll ask my Boss." Comes back with "He dunno either. Call Maroochy Station." So I called them. Again NFI. "Call Brisbane." So I did. Same story there, NFI. They gave me the number to such and such a dept.
So I call this dept, again no one knew. Ended up talking to their Boss. Explained the situation for the 65'th time and he say's, "What sort of arsehole would do that?" I PMSL. Anyhow, he had no idea either, asked me for my name and number and said he'd call me back. Yeah right I thought.
But, 2 days later he did. And in the end, no it couldn't be defected as it was not on the road or footpath etc. Cool, I was happy with that.

Soooooo, my question is, has this changed recently (in Qld) as I know a local bloke up the road here, had two members of the QPS recently walk in to his workshop and defect a vehicle for illegal modifications. There's no if's or but's, it had been extensively modified and not mod plated. But it wasn't on the road, wasn't being driven, sitting in his workshop.

If I modify a vehicle for a customer, throw it on the truck to get some paint work, trim etc done, take it to the Engineer for him to look at, whatever, all before the mod plate being issued, can I now be defected? If so, under these new laws, can that persons vehicle be impounded? Surely it can't be, can it

Do any members here know if that is the case? Or if not, can they point me in the right direction to find out without going through all ^^^^^^ that crap again? Who do I call?

Shane.

[Goose]

If I modify a vehicle for a customer, throw it on the truck to get some paint work, trim etc done, take it to the Engineer for him to look at, whatever, all before the mod plate being issued

I'm not in law enforcement, so I'm just looking at this sentence quoted. My understanding is that if you call ahead to the engineer/mechanic/paintshop etc and tell them you are coming and have a booked appointment you should be OK even if pulled over.

If you get pulled over by the Police on the way, you can ask them to verify with the engineer/mechanic/paintshop that you were on the your way to an appointment. It needs to be reasonably close and you need to taking the most direct/practical route. I know this works in NSW anyway, as my mechanic explained it to me and he has had several cases of the Police letting his customers off because they could prove they were en-route to his workshop.

[Bird]

I'd be interested to hear this too.

However, if it is registered, possibly it should be in a road worthy condition if the plates are fitted

thats how I would see it.
but what about accident damaged cars on trailers, they couldn't defect those could they

[chester ver2.0]

Umm if it is on a trailer to and from the race track why would it be registered in the first place

[Footy Shorts Shane]

I'm not in law enforcement, so I'm just looking at this sentence quoted. My understanding is that if you call ahead to the engineer/mechanic/paintshop etc and tell them you are coming and have a booked appointment you should be OK even if pulled over.

If you get pulled over by the Police on the way, you can ask them to verify with the engineer/mechanic/paintshop that you were on the your way to an appointment. It needs to be reasonably close and you need to taking the most direct/practical route. I know this works in NSW anyway, as my mechanic explained it to me and he has had several cases of the Police letting his customers off because they could prove they were en-route to his workshop.

You would hope that to be the case, but you would also expect that to be the case where a car has left a burn out comp on a trailer with bald tyres also. I know in NSW they can and do get defected on trailers.

I'd be interested to hear this too.
thats how I would see it.
but what about accident damaged cars on trailers, they couldn't defect those could they

That was the first thing I thought.

Umm if it is on a trailer to and from the race track why would it be registered in the first place

There's thousands of guys with daily driven cars and bikes that socially race in circuit, rally, drag race etc. The second you fit race tyres to those vehicles, they need to be trailered. Most though trailer their cars as they know there's every chance it'll bust a clutch, snap an axel etc.

Shane.

[Ian Wilkinson]

Doesn't seem like rocket science to me. If you want to modify a vehicle in a way the breaches the rules then unregister it, simple.

If you don't want to deregister it, then there's most likely some sort of agenda going on, and the police know that. 

[Bird]

Umm if it is on a trailer to and from the race track why would it be registered in the first place

few of my race bikes were registered, but had slicks and replica fairings on road race weekends. Same as a few dudes I raced with.

[Footy Shorts Shane]

Doesn't seem like rocket science to me. If you want to modify a vehicle in a way the breaches the rules then unregister it, simple.

If you don't want to deregister it, then there's most likely some sort of agenda going on, and the police know that. 

Agree 100%

But a modifacation doesn't need to be permanent. As I mentioned earlier, race tyres, nitrous oxide kits. They can all be fitted and removed as need be. Same as some blokes have a couple of thousand dollar mud tyres for their 4x4 that they only play with. Run around most of the time on normal tyres. The vehicles I'm talking about have slicks thrown on them for the weekend.

I have a couple of customers that are very high profile property developers. They are right into their classic and muscle cars. 100% legal and registered cars. I change their tyres, fuel (to a leaded race fuel), rip the seat belt out and bolt in a harness. None of these items are legal on the street. They thrash the guts out of them for a weekend on a race track and drop them back to be returned back to legal again.

Why should they deregister these vehicles? What's sinister about what their doing? Hey, if they run that on the street, then that's a problem. But if it's on a trailer, what's the issue?

Shane.

[Footy Shorts Shane]

few of my race bikes were registered, but had slicks and replica fairings on road race weekends. Same as a few dudes I raced with.

Exactly. We see them all the time at test n tunes. Couple of young P platers with fully hektic VR Commy's. The one with 350K on the clock gets the rear seat, passenger seat, spare and glovebox ripped out so he can get that extra .003 of a second down his 17 second 1/4.

If he trailers the thing there, good on him. Seats go back in on Sunday morning and he drives to work on Monday. Saves his cash for the week and does it next Sat.

Shane.

[Ian Wilkinson]

Agree 100%

But a modifacation doesn't need to be permanent. As I mentioned earlier, race tyres, nitrous oxide kits. They can all be fitted and removed as need be. Same as some blokes have a couple of thousand dollar mud tyres for their 4x4 that they only play with. Run around most of the time on normal tyres. The vehicles I'm talking about have slicks thrown on them for the weekend.

I have a couple of customers that are very high profile property developers. They are right into their classic and muscle cars. 100% legal and registered cars. I change their tyres, fuel (to a leaded race fuel), rip the seat belt out and bolt in a harness. None of these items are legal on the street. They thrash the guts out of them for a weekend on a race track and drop them back to be returned back to legal again.

Why should they deregister these vehicles? What's sinister about what their doing? Hey, if they run that on the street, then that's a problem. But if it's on a trailer, what's the issue?

Shane.

Yeah good point, better rethink my stand there.

[berlitza]

Wouldnt that mean that any vehicle that has been forcefully modified ( accident)  and sitting on a tow truck come under the same scrutiny, written off farm vehicles and  paddock bashes would have to come under the same legislation as well wouldn't it, bugger better go and hide the mini moke that has an after market xorst

[chester ver2.0]

few of my race bikes were registered, but had slicks and replica fairings on road race weekends. Same as a few dudes I raced with.

Ahhh got it

[Mallory Black]

I'm not a copper either but you can't defect a vehicle that's not being driven on a public road.
end of story. 
A trailer is as good as a tow truck, which carries registered, but unroadworthy vehicles all the time be that from an accident or for mechanical reasons.
I would challenge any ticket like that

[D4D]

...I know a local bloke up the road here, had two members of the QPS recently walk in to his workshop and defect a vehicle for illegal modifications. There's no if's or but's, it had been extensively modified and not mod plated. But it wasn't on the road, wasn't being driven, sitting in his workshop.

Me thinks the car was probably reported to the for some other offence and they tracked it down to the workshop...

[GUEY]

If your trailering it to the track pull the rego plates off it. If your pulled over it's just a race car on a trailer.

[McGirr]

I wonder how the V8 Super cars get away with it.

Mark

[Mallory Black]

Hang on- correction to my earlier post. the car can also be parked on the road or , could still get a ticket.
So a car on a trailer or tow truck is neither being used or driven or parked... on a road.

Some police or transport officers might say that if the car is regisered then it must comply with their vehicle standards whatever regardless but there's no precedent to say that they can slug a car being transported on a registered trailer or another vehicle because it's not on a public road.

Best they could do is tell you that they want to see it over an inspection pit and your choice is make it legal or de-register it. but book you?  I'd call the bluff

as for police entering a workshop, yes there's a provision for officers to enter a premises but it relates more to the sale of a vehicle than anything else and the wording is very clear.

I suggest that the workshop owner stick a big sign next to the office, no unauthorised persons allowed past this point. politely decline access and cite health & safety & insurance liabilities.

[kylarama]

Years ago we went to the Summernats.  Saw a highly modded show car (the type that never see the road and get towed to shows) with defect stickers on it.
Story was guy busted a hub or bearing on the car trailer just out of Canberra.  Took the tow car off the trailer so they could jack it up with a pissy little scissor jack.  Boys in blue came along, pulled out the fine book and went to town on the show car.

[gronk]

Years ago we went to the Summernats.  Saw a highly modded show car (the type that never see the road and get towed to shows) with defect stickers on it.
Story was guy busted a hub or bearing on the car trailer just out of Canberra.  Took the tow car off the trailer so they could jack it up with a pissy little scissor jack.  Boys in blue came along, pulled out the fine book and went to town on the show car.

Just goes to show how "pigheaded" some coppers can get....no wonder even their own mothers don't like them ( Highway Patrol )

They get even less respect from me when I see them speeding and also doing burnouts just for the fun of it......

[mickmac42]

https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/SLS/2010/10SL192.pdf

The vehicle must be driven or parked on a road. Police can't just waltz into your shed and defect your vehicle. May be a different story if they've seen you driving it on the road. Same goes for cars at the race track. If anyone got a ticket for towing a defective car on a trailer, it'd quickly be withdrawn upon appeal because it would never make it through the Court room.

I'm always wary of the "it happened to a friend of mine" stories.

Mike

[Footy Shorts Shane]

Hang on- correction to my earlier post. the car can also be parked on the road or , could still get a ticket.
So a car on a trailer or tow truck is neither being used or driven or parked... on a road.

That's what I said in my initial post. That has always been the case, in QLD at least, but has it changed?

Shane.

[Footy Shorts Shane]

I'm always wary of the "it happened to a friend of mine" stories.

I haven't had anyone confirm the defecting on the trailer issue, hence why I stated "apparantly."

The defect to the other car at the workshop. Oh, that happened, and could not have happened to a nicer bloke 

If your trailering it to the track pull the rego plates off it. If your pulled over it's just a race car on a trailer.

It's still registered though.

Years ago we went to the Summernats.  Saw a highly modded show car (the type that never see the road and get towed to shows) with defect stickers on it.
Story was guy busted a hub or bearing on the car trailer just out of Canberra.  Took the tow car off the trailer so they could jack it up with a pissy little scissor jack.  Boys in blue came along, pulled out the fine book and went to town on the show car.

One of my customers has a VERY nice Holden 1 tonner. Quiet a few modifications, all plated and legal, or so he thought. After almost an hour being screwed over on the side of the road for a "random licence check", nothing could be found wrong with his vehicle. So he was ordered to have it inspected at a local Qld Tpt inspection station for a db test. The car came into work, we went over EVERYTHING before it had to be presented to Qld Tpt. Couldn't find anything wrong with it.

What I didn't know at that time was, because it's a 1 Tonner, it's a commercial vehicle. It must have load rated wheels and light truck tyres fitted, not alloy wheels and passenger tyres. He was defected.

Shane.

[Steffo1]

Mmmmm, I'm thinking that, if a vehicle is road registered, it would be deemed as being capable of being driven on the road so must past muster whether it's on the road or not!
Having a spare tyre is not mandatory but, if you have one, it has to be roadworthy even if it's just sitting in the boot or tray, not in use on the vehicle. It MIGHT be used on the road.
I think it would be assumed that rego equates to road use!
Not that I agree.

[Bird]

What I didn't know at that time was, because it's a 1 Tonner, it's a commercial vehicle. It must have load rated wheels and light truck tyres fitted, not alloy wheels and passenger tyres. He was defected.

yep, same as most dual cabs with bling wheels on them, or falcadore utes with rubberband tyres.

[scubasteve]

 They were pinging people up our way for incorrect load ratings on Bling wheels on 4WD's.