Camper Prices

[Teabag]

I propose and interesting question. Do you think that there still remains good value in many of the Camper Trailer manufacturers out there, noting some of the exorbinate prices they are charging? To use a Kimberley Kamper (many other brands the same and isn't isolated to KK alone) but to charge over $50k for a camper (tent on wheels) is the value still there? I bought a new KK Limited Edition which was spec'ed up nearly to a top of the range Platinum in 2005 and it was a struggle to cough up $34k then but to now ask $54k (mate bought one last year) does seem excessive? IMO, KK is an excellent camper that is very well built but is very hard to swallow the price compared to what you can buy and off road caravan for......Thoughts?

 PS: This isn't a shot at any people who have spent such money in any way. Nor is it a shot at KK or any other Camper manufacturer. Its just an observation as even the cheaper brands and getting dearer...:-)

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[muzza01]

Sort of agree with you TB. I would much rather a Cub, KK or CY trailer in lieu of my own imported one but the $$ is very high on these versions even for a 2nd hand price.  I know that you can buy one of these brands and safely say that they don't need to be checked over or modified to go offroad unlike my import that I have spent a lot of time and $$ so far to get the same result.

At the end of the day, a CT is just a tent on wheels with a few luxuries thrown in and doesn't compare too well $$ wise to an offroad caravan that is loaded with the luxuries.

[Paul (SA)]

I have to agree with u TB. I couldn't justify the cost of a new CT of the type u are talking about. Others could probably afford it though.

When u weigh up cost vs benefit, I thought Johnnos or Tambo were about par for me.

[scarps]

I've just ordered a new Trackabout Safari SV Extenda for around the $30k mark and compared to the off road caravan I was looking at, it was under half the price, so I guess for me I'm happy I'm getting great quality and value for my $$.  Having said that, I did look at the KK's, CC's and AS's that were much more expensive and felt that while they were of a very good build quality, they were just too spec'd up for what I needed.
We did also initially look at the cheaper end of the CT market and while there was no doubt many of these would have also done the job, I wasn't convinced for how long and whether after 10 years of constant use, that there would have been much left to trade in or sell apart from a box trailer.  I guess from a depreciation value, that's not necessarily bad, but then for me it came down to quality, comfort and reliability for the next 10 years of which we expect to do 6 to 10 trips pa, ranging from weekends to a 4 week trip through the red centre.

[KingBilly]

I'm hearing you Teabag.  Still trying to justify the money I spent on my CT which was a lot cheaper than the top of the range KKs etc to which you refer.  I'm still finding it difficult to get my head around paying $20K for a tent on a box trailer.  Admittedly it is a mighty fine box trailer and an excellently made tent but it is still a tent on a trailer.

I think customers have become more accepting of paying a premium, whether or not that premium is still justifiable.

But having said that, I would still prefer a CT over a caravan.  Nothing like sleeping under canvas in the bush/outback.  Don't need a microwave or TV.  I go camping to escape that rubbish 

KB

[RebsWA]

Tent on wheels sums it up well IMO. Would rather put that sort of money into a caravan and have some luxury.

[MDS69]

I want to compare apples with oranges.
a tent on essentially a box trailer verse for example
a Toyota Prado for $60k that has expansive R&D, a computer controlled transmission, wonderful technology in passenger safety (airbags, traction/stability control etc) a hi tech V6 petrol engine with all sorts of computer controlled sensors, 2 x diffs, 5 x wheels and tyres, glass, power window regulators, sound system, chassis, panels, paint, dual zone climate A/C and the list goes on if you break the vehicle down into parts. Obviously economy of scale makes some of these parts cheaper but......

Break a CT down and you have box trailer, 3 x wheels and tyres, hitch, basic suspension, diesel heater for the top end CT's, 2 or 4 burner gas cooker, canvas tent, fairly basic electronics....

[Bird]

Considering the difficulties dozens are having selling used trailers I'd say the market is talking...

I could never spend $30k on a trailer that gets used dozen times a year on a outstanding year, and just sits there.

The market will justify the companies that will last and those that will disappear.

[Alan Loy]

Another way of looking at it is to add up what the pieces cost.

How much is a good trailer?  (I think they are bigger than 6x4)
How much is a good tent?
How much is a good kitchen?

How much to put it all together so it works?

If you can build a KK equivalent for $30,000 then perhaps you should go in to business.  I would buy one for that price.

To answer the original question I think that outback campers http://www.outbackcampers.com.au/ and bushranger campers http://www.bushrangercampers.com.au/# produce older style campers at older style prices.  I'm sure that there are many others out there.

[kylarama]

I could never spend $30k on a trailer that gets used dozen times a year on a outstanding year, and just sits there.

This quote probably sums up best for majority of campers, especially your average family with young children.

Cost verses amount of use, sort of explains why those sub 5K Chinese campers are popular.  Use generally extends to Christmas, Easter and one or two long weekends in between.

We paid 16K for our Jayco and that was a MASSIVE investment for us on a luxury item that gets used 1/2 dozen times a year.
A 3-4K 2nd hand camper would have served our needs fine, but after doing a 4 month trip 7 years ago with only a basic Hilux and an old single pole Southern Cross tent we figured we're entitled to a little luxury now
We plan on owning it for 10+ years so purchased something we really wanted for long term, but figure due to their popularity should be reasonably easy to sell (and expect to lose a bit of money) if the need arises.

[Kangaron]

Cost vs amount of use just about sums it up.
I look at our CT as our "moveable" holiday home.
So far this year 63 nights under canvas in 8 trips. [ 3 nights in a CP, the rest in the bush ] for next to no cost.
How much would that have cost in accommodation alone?
It depends on what level of comfort you require, as to how much you spend/can afford.
Ours is basic as that is what we enjoy.

[berlitza]

Also have to agree, to spend 30-50k on a tent to me is a little excessive but at the end of the day if you have no mortgage or any other debt and top of the range kk is what  you want then go for it. I have a relative who paid 140k for an inveco winnebago only to have it sit under the carport 42 +weeks of the year and there lifes constitution is ' ya only get one chance at life,get what ya want while ya still healthy enough to enjoy it'.
I think  a lot of aussie manufacturers have lot the 'perceived value for money' rule in business.

[Nomad]

my way of thinking was along the lines of MDS........60K for a prado or 50K for a KK...doesn't work...but toyota has a worldwide market selling thousands per month whereas KK might sell one or two per month. They have to charge that sort of money to pay for overheads to keep the doors open.

If Teabag paid 34k for a 2005 and the same now is 54K.............would Teabag get his 34K back on resale........I reckon he would go close. So the real cost is the opportunity cost of having that 34K invested in shares............would be interesting to do the calculations.

I also think that the cost of renting a KK, or equivalent, if you only use it a few times a year is probably the the most economical way to look at it.

Cheers Nomad.

[Pipeliner]

We started camping with a basic soft floor offroad camper: then when we got tired of folding up all that canvas we bought a top of the range Odyssey with all the bells and whistles.  We paid $43k for it 7 years ago and judging by the few that are advertised it is still worth about that (although I have no idea whether the advertisers actually get their asking price!).

Was it worth it? - well it is to us.  We take it out for around 4-5 weekends a year, we take it down to Adelaide (from Brisbane) every Christmas and once every two years on average we take it out for a 6 week extended tour to remote places.  Next year we plan to take it to WA via Uluru and the Great Central Highway - not a trip I would fancy in some of the cheaper campers!

The arguement about comparing the value of a Prado with a camper is fallacious: if campers were sold in sufficient quantities to justify setting up robotic production lines then maybe the prices could be similar but the campers are built individually by experienced craftsmen which is why the really good ones cost so much.

AORC campers/caravans may be expensive but they do what they are designed to do and do it superbly - and as long as the order book is filled for 6-7 months ahead there is no reason for them to lower their prices.

[Bird]

I also think that the cost of renting a KK, or equivalent, if you only use it a few times a year is probably the the most economical way to look at it.

I'd agree with that. $50,000 is a lot of weekends hire... and you dont have to store it!!!

[Alan Loy]

Interesting that Echo now use CNC & robots.  The Echo 6 http://www.echo4x4.com.au/echo6.php seems a lot of camper for the money.  This may be why.

[KeithB]

I don't know how big the camper trailer market is in Australia. But just looking at http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm , there are 132 camper trailer manufacturers listed.

It's hard to see how any of them could achieve any real economies of scale. Small volume may go part of the way to explaining the high prices.

[scarps]

I don't know how big the camper trailer market is in Australia. But just looking at http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm , there are 132 camper trailer manufacturers listed.

It's hard to see how any of them could achieve any real economies of scale. Small volume may go part of the way to explaining the high prices.

The other thing I found when searching for my CT, is that the quality Aus CT builders are all very proud of their product and out of respect for their past, current and future customers, won't compromise on the quality or features. I daresay they could all build a cheapie, but why put their brand at risk while they have customer orders coming in.

[Bird]

I don't know how big the camper trailer market is in Australia. But just looking at http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm , there are 132 camper trailer manufacturers listed.

Many on that list have long gone. Last updated July 2011

[GeeTee]

 $34K... I reckon that's about $54K seven years later

[Barry G]

Many on that list have long gone. Last updated July 2011

And others had gone before that - e.g. Heaslip.
Would be interesting to know how many have come and gone in the last 10 years.

[Barry G]

With both cars and campers I'm always happy to have others pay the 'turn key tax'.
ALWAYS cheaper to buy a quality item second hand.  Just a matter of waiting for what you want to turn up!

[swanny]

Defo way over priced to my mind, don't get me wrong the top of line CT's are great bits of kit, as many have said, but I tend to follow what Lost has said, I couldn't justify that sort of cash for something that I would use 10-15 times a year, and that is pushing time off to the limits.

I sort of feel that the prices will have to come back or they wont sell long term, I earn good coin, but still wouldn't pay those prices, not for a tent on wheels essentially.

Swanny

[Pipeliner]

I'd agree with that. $50,000 is a lot of weekends hire... and you dont have to store it!!!

Granted it is probably cheaper to hire, but...........

• All trips have to be planned well in advance - no "fancy a trip out this weekend?"
• All your gear has to be packed in before the trip and unpacked afterwards - this takes time better spent on the trip
• Rental campers are basic, with none of the little mods you have made over the years to improve the camping experience
• You have to trust that the camper has been serviced regularly, and that the bearings aren't going to sieze for lack of grease

In terms of $/day of use I probably have an expensive camper, but it gets cheaper the longer I own it.  If I had gone into debt to buy it I might have thought differently, but fortunately I didn't have to.

[gronk]

It really comes down to what you want the trailer to do for you ?

If I was happy with what a $10,000 soft floor camper did for me, then that's what I would have bought......but instead, I bought 2 KK's ( now have an Adventure Trek AT 10 ) because they did almost everything that I wanted out of a camper..

Now........if I couldn't have afforded them, then yes, the $10,000 camper would have had to do, and although it wouldn't have been what we wanted, money obviously talks !!

Now, you'll always get someone with a $90,000 200 series who doesn't want to part with $40,000 for a camper ( why wouldn't they buy a $50,000 4wd and a $50,000 camper ?? ) and on the other side of the coin you'll get someone who's happy with a $20,000 4wd towing a $70,000 caravan !!!!!!...............so it's really what suits everyone......

But what peeves me a bit is the bloke belittling the bloke for spending up big on either a 4wd or a camper ??
If you can't afford something, either admire the bloke for having the money ( and the nice new camper ), or find a way to do the same ( but don't feel bad about it !!