Author Topic: Which Camper and Tow vehicle  (Read 12300 times)

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Offline clarkey 1967

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Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« on: April 09, 2013, 10:54:48 AM »
Well Im sure this post may get a few responses.. hopefully.
A friend of mine is planning on purchasing a 4X4 and camper enabling him to spend time travelling around different areas of OZ. He had mentioned he is keen to head up to Cape York, the Kimberlies and other areas requiring confidence in his rigs.
He has indicated his budget in total is around $60K (car and camper).

I have my own rigs (07 GU patrol and a mediuam priced type camper) but having not travelled to the areas he is planning to, I dont feel I can adequately advise him of the types campers to explore. I have no doubt the patrol can get him there and back so long at its been looked after, serviced etc (post 04 models) but the camper is a tougher thing.

He has allowed $35K for the tow vehicle and $25 for the camper. I have explained to him there will be a number of other purchases he will have to make other than the rig and camper (ie fridge etc etc and any mods he needs to make to both).

So I put it to you what would you advise him to do. Any input will be appreciated

PS he lives in South Australia.
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2011 allied pacific camper..

Offline Bird

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2013, 11:00:45 AM »
How long is a piece of string?
I'd be spending more on the tow rig, and less on the camper. There's some top quality used trailers on the forum <$10k.

Tow Rig: go test drive as many things as possible.

How many people?
etc...
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 11:07:14 AM by Lost »
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Offline DannyG

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2013, 11:05:01 AM »

I'd be spending more on the tow rig, and less on the camper. There's some top quality used trailers on the forum <$10k.


I agree with this.

Search around for a good second hand aussie camper that suits his needs (his needs will dictate the camper he buys) and after spending 10-15k on a good second hand unit that will more than likely come with most pof the gear he needs, then he will know what else he needs to buy and how much is left to buy a tow rig.

As for the tow rig well the list is endless but I sure he has some idea of what he wants.
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Offline clarkey 1967

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2013, 11:11:27 AM »
Yes you both are spot on with the second hand rig...

I guess where Im going with this is the quality of the camper to tackle these places.. especially the Cape. There will be times he is travelling on his own but I doubt, given his lack of experience, he would do the tougher trips on his own.

Personally I wouldnt be confident taking my camper anywhere too hardcore. Its stated as an off roader but I have seen true off road campers and mine aint them. I see people on here with the kimberley camper and those other cool ones... camprites.. They look built for tough terrains.
07 TI Patrol
2011 allied pacific camper..

Offline Bird

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2013, 11:34:18 AM »
How many people are travelling? Wife/kids/dogs?

You don't need to buy a $50,000 kewl looking trailer to go to the Cape

Have a look at some of the Cape York trip threads McGirr has done.
Theres been every brand and model of trailer... they all suffer damage, even the most expensive have bent drawbars.

http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=26034.0
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=26181.0
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=26266.0
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=23412.0
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 11:50:59 AM by Lost »
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Offline dazzler

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Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2013, 01:22:28 PM »
I would choose a prado auto for the tug. Silver, 1kz engine, around 200k's on the clock, some kings, billies, silent armour tyres and Roberts your fathers brother.
My alternative to cheap import trailers;

http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=36094.msg578367#msg578367


Offline McGirr

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2013, 01:41:47 PM »

My 2000 model cruiser cost $17,000 with 130,000 klm and a 2004 model tough country camper which cost $8,100.

They do the job for me.

Mark
Living the dream working our way around Australia.

Ernabella SA, Warburton WA, Mt Barnett Roadhouse in the Kimberley, Peppimenarti NT, Ramingining NT, Gapuwiyak NT, Gunbalanya NT, Bidyadanga WA, Ali Curung NT, Tjuntjuntjara WA. 18 places

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Offline Marcus73

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Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2013, 02:01:33 PM »
I would choose a prado auto for the tug. Silver, 1kz engine, around 200k's on the clock, some kings, billies, silent armour tyres and Roberts your fathers brother.

Do you happen to know of any for sale? ;)

Offline clarkey 1967

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2013, 02:09:30 PM »
thankyou for your replies... any others welcome

PS that cruiser sounds a bargain!!
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Offline clarkey 1967

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2013, 02:14:46 PM »
PS the Prado looks nice too..
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2011 allied pacific camper..

Offline duggie

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2013, 02:38:31 PM »
I am not going to knock any brand of 4x4, nor am I going to give advertisment for one brand over another, but I will give an honest point from observation.
 Last year on the cape trip there were quite a few Parado auto,s along the way with auto tranny over temp problems due to the long steep hills and the long drags of sand/dirt roads, not all of them were pulling camp trailers.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 07:45:49 PM by duggie »
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Offline Bird

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2013, 03:55:43 PM »
Quote from: McGirr
My 2000 model cruiser cost $17,000 with 130,000 klm and a 2004 model tough country camper which cost $8,100.

They do the job for me.

That's what I was getting at. You don't NEED to spend $80,000 on a trailer + mods and car.
Marks been to the cape half a dozen times (well it seems like it from the reports that make me cry when I read em...) in recent years.

heres a good unit
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=21717.0
you'd get that for $20k easily.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 04:08:35 PM by Lost »
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Offline 02-SR5

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2013, 04:00:58 PM »
You can buy a Brand new Challenger for less than 40k these days if you looked around.

15k would get you an awesome off road camper and this will leave some money to spend at your local 4wd store.

Rob
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Offline dazzler

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2013, 06:01:07 PM »
Being serious. If it were me I would buy a 100series petrol manual in white or silver.  Whack some old man emus in it and a decent set of new tyres and away you go.  Flog it off when you get home.

Second hand Tambo or similar from myswag.  Less than 30k.  Go and have some fun!
My alternative to cheap import trailers;

http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=36094.msg578367#msg578367


Offline Brad_m

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2013, 07:29:40 PM »
Solid axle 100 series or a GU with a TD42.     Anything less just isn't heavy duty enough to deal with towing and the punishment of off road work.     ALL of the 4cyl turbo diesel duel cabs have clutch problems and are thirsty with an auto.
D40 (YD25 engine) navaras have problems with timing chains and guides, oil pump failures and turbo failures. 
Ask my sister, almost $5000 in trade price parts to fix the turbo, guides and oil pump. They  were just lucky her husband spotted the oil pressure light as soon as it came on and he shut the engine down. 
I know of 5 sub 90 000km D40's with the same oil pump failure and that's just in Townsville in the last 12 months.  There is going to be 6th on soon. I had the lower sump off one to repair a stripped thread and found the tell tale oil pump debris in the bottom.  (the guy traded it on a new car)
Avoid any nissan with a ZD30 engine.
Hilux's have injector problems.

Tritons have issues with EGR depositing carbon through the intake, same for BT-50/Ranger plus on the last two the T-MAP  (combined intake temp and manifold pressure sensor) is a few cm away from the EGR port and it blocks up the sensor in less then 50 000km.

BT-50/Ranger also has problems with cracking EGR coolers allowing coolant to enter the intake.

It's been mentioned already about Prado trans temp issues.

Patrols and Cruisers just keep going and don't suffer any of these issues so long as you stay away from anything with a ZD30 engine it  or the V8 diesel cruiser as it has the same injector issues as the Hilux.

Before anyone says anything about Patrol 5th gear splins, they are a cheap fix compared all of the above. Plus you can get upgraded parts to stop it reoccurring.     With the other problems mentioned, you can only replace broken substandard parts with new substandard parts.


 

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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2013, 07:53:35 PM »
.............
Have a look at some of the Cape York trip threads McGirr has done.
Theres been every brand and model of trailer... they all suffer damage...........
............

......not all......... ;D ;D
Geoff and Kay

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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2013, 07:59:22 PM »
..........
Before anyone says anything about Patrol 5th gear splins, they are a cheap fix compared all of the above. Plus you can get upgraded parts to stop it reoccurring........

Yep, the upgraded parts really are quite cheap.......$330 for a new main shaft and 5th gear. I had mine done before the Cape trip last year. Caught it before it actually failed.......just. It was an opportunity to update the clutch as well.

Good summation Brad. Looks like you've seen the insides of a few........bit of a worry, though.......
Geoff and Kay

1999 GU TD42T wagon
2005 Coota Camper - gone, but never forgotten
2020 North Coast 15' Titanium - tandem, of course

Land Cruiser.....the Patrol that Toyota try to build.....

Offline Snapman007

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2013, 10:30:32 PM »
What are your thought on a NS Pajero with the 3.2 TD?
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Offline DannyG

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2013, 12:35:39 AM »
Solid axle 100 series or a GU with a TD42.     Anything less just isn't heavy duty enough to deal with towing and the punishment of off road work.     ALL of the 4cyl turbo diesel duel cabs have clutch problems and are thirsty with an auto.
D40 (YD25 engine) navaras have problems with timing chains and guides, oil pump failures and turbo failures. 
Ask my sister, almost $5000 in trade price parts to fix the turbo, guides and oil pump. They  were just lucky her husband spotted the oil pressure light as soon as it came on and he shut the engine down. 
I know of 5 sub 90 000km D40's with the same oil pump failure and that's just in Townsville in the last 12 months.  There is going to be 6th on soon. I had the lower sump off one to repair a stripped thread and found the tell tale oil pump debris in the bottom.  (the guy traded it on a new car)
Avoid any nissan with a ZD30 engine.
Hilux's have injector problems.

Tritons have issues with EGR depositing carbon through the intake, same for BT-50/Ranger plus on the last two the T-MAP  (combined intake temp and manifold pressure sensor) is a few cm away from the EGR port and it blocks up the sensor in less then 50 000km.

BT-50/Ranger also has problems with cracking EGR coolers allowing coolant to enter the intake.

It's been mentioned already about Prado trans temp issues.

Patrols and Cruisers just keep going and don't suffer any of these issues so long as you stay away from anything with a ZD30 engine it  or the V8 diesel cruiser as it has the same injector issues as the Hilux.

Before anyone says anything about Patrol 5th gear splins, they are a cheap fix compared all of the above. Plus you can get upgraded parts to stop it reoccurring.     With the other problems mentioned, you can only replace broken substandard parts with new substandard parts.


 



Some brutal honesty right there from someone who has an idea by the sounds of it.
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Offline clarkey 1967

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #19 on: April 10, 2013, 10:27:43 AM »
Thank you again for your input..
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2011 allied pacific camper..

Offline Nutto

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #20 on: April 10, 2013, 10:52:14 AM »
.......ALL of the 4cyl turbo diesel duel cabs have clutch problems and are thirsty with an auto.
D40 (YD25 engine) navaras have problems with timing chains and guides, oil pump failures and turbo failures. 
Ask my sister, almost $5000 in trade price parts to fix the turbo, guides and oil pump. They  were just lucky her husband spotted the oil pressure light as soon as it came on and he shut the engine down. 
I know of 5 sub 90 000km D40's with the same oil pump failure and that's just in Townsville in the last 12 months.  There is going to be 6th on soon. I had the lower sump off one to repair a stripped thread and found the tell tale oil pump debris in the bottom.  (the guy traded it on a new car)
Avoid any nissan with a ZD30 engine.
Hilux's have injector problems.

Tritons have issues with EGR depositing carbon through the intake, same for BT-50/Ranger plus on the last two the T-MAP  (combined intake temp and manifold pressure sensor) is a few cm away from the EGR port and it blocks up the sensor in less then 50 000km.

BT-50/Ranger also has problems with cracking EGR coolers allowing coolant to enter the intake.

It's been mentioned already about Prado trans temp issues.

Patrols and Cruisers just keep going and don't suffer any of these issues so long as you stay away from anything with a ZD30 engine it  or the V8 diesel cruiser as it has the same injector issues as the Hilux.

Before anyone says anything about Patrol 5th gear splins, they are a cheap fix compared all of the above. Plus you can get upgraded parts to stop it reoccurring.     With the other problems mentioned, you can only replace broken substandard parts with new substandard parts.

ALL  dual cabs in this case sounds like D40 Nissans ???
D-max has been fine so far for me - no sign of clutch issues after 45k,  with over half of that towing as below.   That said, I am mindful of how I treat the clutch and, as you state, there are some real issues out there with puss clutches on Dual cabs.  I looked into this a fair bit before settling on Isuzu 2 years ago - there was no cases in the interweb that I could see in this regard.   Also, the now older model dmax I have was de-tuned in auto form in terms of Torque output.  If I was to get the new model now, the new auto box and matching pwr/torque to the manual would be a no brainer.

Back on topic...
Spending $25k instead of say $15k on a camper does not get you $10,000 worth of better camper in my opinion, e.g  $15k will get you a good trackabout that is only a few years old.
Re tow rig - yes you could get away with under 20k for a 10-12 yr old rig with low k's IF you can find one,  but if, as in this case, the money is there,  then get as new as you can.

 :cheers:
Nutto

Offline Brad_m

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #21 on: April 10, 2013, 08:42:25 PM »
Seeing the inside of the broken and buggered is my job. 

Most of the clutch issues IMO is because these things have no power off boost and don't have a short enough 1st gear to deal with it.
People tend to rev them higher and slip the clutch to get them moving,  If you treat them nice and use less revs and be happy with a slower take off speed the clutches last longer. 
I also find the low range is a good option when trying to maneuver trailer etc. (if you don't have auto looking front hubs)   
Even then, we still get noise issues from duel mass flywheels.

 
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Offline GeoffA

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2013, 09:25:04 PM »
Seeing the inside of the broken and buggered is my job...........

The worry for me is that you see so many with big $$ issues......
Geoff and Kay

1999 GU TD42T wagon
2005 Coota Camper - gone, but never forgotten
2020 North Coast 15' Titanium - tandem, of course

Land Cruiser.....the Patrol that Toyota try to build.....

Offline Brad_m

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #23 on: April 11, 2013, 06:40:13 AM »
The worry for me is that you see so many with big $$ issues......

The industry calls it 'Designed obsolescence'.  The design of parts now days is the point that they can build cars to last to a certain age.  Cars are built to last marginally beyond the warranty period.  Dealer/manufacturers are only required to keep spare parts available for 5 years. After that they don't care about that model anymore and they want you to buy a new one.

As time goes on, the trend we are seeing is that these sorts of failures are getting more common and are costing more and more to fix.

In most cases these days, due to packaging, if you want to remove the engine from a IFS 4x4, you need to take the gear box out first.   Then it's not uncommon to see multiple timing chains and gear drives with hours spent on the actual repair, often needing special tools that we need to fight the dealers to obtain. 

If your interested, check out the 'choice of repairer' campaign headed by the AA AA   
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Offline Bird

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Re: Which Camper and Tow vehicle
« Reply #24 on: April 11, 2013, 11:56:49 AM »
Quote from: Brad_m
The industry calls it 'Designed obsolescence'.  The design of parts now days is the point that they can build cars to last to a certain age.  Cars are built to last marginally beyond the warranty period. 
Dealer/manufacturers are only required to keep spare parts available for 5 years. After that they don't care about that model anymore and they want you to buy a new one.

I thought I was the only one that realised this 15 years ago....
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