240 OR 12 VOLT ?

[cetacean]

G'day all,
              We're off camping with friends over the Aus Day weekend, staying at a powered site in a caravan park right next to the Harvey Estuary near Dawsville. Hardly camping really, but the weathers looking good for lots of water activities with plenty of crabbing, fishing, skiing, swimming  etc for the kids to keep them all happy
    It's the first time in 3 years with our camper that we've actually stayed in a caravan park and had 240volt power available, we usually free camp and use our great solar/12 volt installed by Burnsy
   . Now my question is am I better off just plugging my engel(s) straight  into the 240 power or run them off my 12 volt set-up and keep my batteries topped up using my Projecta charger off the 240 volt.?
   Or maybe it's 6 of one and a half dozen of the other ?

Cheers Darryl

[jwb]

If it was me, I would use 12 volt and plug the charger in to maintain the batteries!

cheers

[Mandrake]

Maybe half and half - run solar only during the daylight then if the batteries are getting down switch on the charger ...
If Burnsy got it all right then you shouldn't need 240V at all unless it gets cloudy ... Mandrake

[barnray]

Use 240v when you can. R

[KingBilly]

Does your 240V battery charger have a "power supply" mode?  My Projecta does.  If so, I would set it to that and run everything off 12V.  If not, to reduce the cycling of your batteries, I would probably put my biggest load, i.e. fridge, on 240V.  But there is not much difference either way I would think.

Have a great holiday.

KB

[Jeepers Creepers]

If your paying for a powered site, ya may as well use the 240 volts.

[Burnsy]

If youare paying for 240 just plug the engel into that.  You will have enough battery power to run your lights for the weekend so I would not even take the solar.  In seven nights last week when doing this we used a total of 37 Ah running lights and charging dvd players and I have the same lights as you so for two or three nights you should not even need to charge the battery.

[Trackabout Off Road Campers]

If your paying for a powered site, ya may as well use the 240 volts.

X2

[McGirr]

A no brainier as mentioned use the 240volts, it's there. Sorry but I laugh when people run chargers etc to top up the battery so they can run fridges when they are at a powered site. 

Common sense please.

Mark

[cetacean]

A no brainier as mentioned use the 240volts, it's there. Sorry but I laugh when people run chargers etc to top up the battery so they can run fridges when they are at a powered site. 

Common sense please.

Mark

I does make perfect sense I know Mark, when you stop and think about it. This 12 volt stuff is all fairly new to me and I'm just getting the hang of things.
I used to run a remote fishing camp in the north-west of WA and all I had to do was start the gen-set and plug everything I needed into that ! The good 'ol days

Cheers Darryl

[KingBilly]

A no brainier as mentioned use the 240volts, it's there. Sorry but I laugh when people run chargers etc to top up the battery so they can run fridges when they are at a powered site. 

Common sense please.

Mark

Yeah but that means packing the 240V power supply for the fridge, an extra power lead plus a power board.  Not much I know but I have to remember to do it    Plus we have limited space.  We haven't got a cavernous truck like some    Come to think of it, some pretty poor excuses 

But I purposely set up our CT so everything was packed ready to go regardless of where we were going.  Chuck the fridge and food in and we're off.  Everything is 12V and gas.  Selected a Projecta charger so it runs everything in power supply mode when we have 240V available which is not often.  Each to their own I guess.

KB

[Estelle]

You are using their 240V to either keep your batteries charged or run the fridge. More efficient to run the fridges off 240V (not your power though) and saves the cycling of the battery if there is any at all. Less heat in the CT etc.

If using the charger on 'power supply mode', will it have enough current capacity to feed all of your needs if they all run at once? Why cycle the batteries unnecessarily?

[KingBilly]

More efficient to run the fridges off 240V

Cost efficient, yes, but energy efficient, I'm not so sure.

Less heat in the CT etc.

Don't understand?  The 240V transformer generates heat as does the battery charger.  Both are negligible.  Am I missing something?

If using the charger on 'power supply mode', will it have enough current capacity to feed all of your needs if they all run at once? Why cycle the batteries unnecessarily?

The power supply mode has enough capacity for all my needs.  The whole idea of using power supply mode is so that my batteries do not cycle.  Or that is my understanding anyway.  Perhaps somebody could correct me and I may have to rethink my power use.

KB

[cruisindub]

240v volt site, your paying for it anyway. Same as the big caravans with air con, micro, etc etc.

Used to annoy me in our camper wen I paid for a powered site just to keep batteries topped up when everything was set up for free camping..........

I'd be taking the spaare bar fridge, elec kettle/toaster/frypan, TV, floodlights,

Get your monies worth ........it'll make camping so much easier.

Besides, you cook proper toast in an electric toaster!

[Estelle]

Cost efficient, yes, but energy efficient, I'm not so sure.

Don't understand?  The 240V transformer generates heat as does the battery charger.  Both are negligible.  Am I missing something?

The power supply mode has enough capacity for all my needs.  The whole idea of using power supply mode is so that my batteries do not cycle.  Or that is my understanding anyway.  Perhaps somebody could correct me and I may have to rethink my power use.

KB

I assume energy efficient as you are not using the battery charger which has its losses. I doubt a battery charger is efficient, so if not needed, don't use it?

Less heat as there is less equipment running if the battery charger is not used to provide the 12V for the fridges. Would you need the battery charger on to trickle charge battery? Once it is charged, turn off the charger.

The charger will get hot to keep up with the 12V drain for the fridge(s) changing 240V to 12V. Needless losses producing heat.

Does the fridge(s) have the same wattage rating on 240V as on 12V?

In "power supply mode", does the charger just see the fridge use (when compressor is running) and think the battery needs a bit more of a kick along. Just current or more volts?

There is no guarantee all the fridge and other power requirements will come from the charger alone. Some chargers in "power supply mode" provide a lower voltage than when in normal charge mode. Ie, the battery can have a higher voltage than the charger supplies in "power supply mode".

[KingBilly]

I assume energy efficient as you are not using the battery charger which has its losses. I doubt a battery charger is efficient, so if not needed, don't use it?

Fridge only runs on 12V DC.  So you're saying a 240V AC to 12V DC transformer to run the fridge is more efficient than a 240V AC battery charger supplying a constant 13.8V DC to run the fridge?  I would guess they are pretty much the same in regards to energy efficiency.

Less heat as there is less equipment running if the battery charger is not used to provide the 12V for the fridges. Would you need the battery charger on to trickle charge battery? Once it is charged, turn off the charger.

The charger will get hot to keep up with the 12V drain for the fridge(s) changing 240V to 12V. Needless losses producing heat.

And the 240V AC to 12V DC transformer doesn't generate heat?  Again, much of a muchness I think.

Does the fridge(s) have the same wattage rating on 240V as on 12V?

Fridge only runs on 12V DC.

In "power supply mode", does the charger just see the fridge use (when compressor is running) and think the battery needs a bit more of a kick along. Just current or more volts?

There is no guarantee all the fridge and other power requirements will come from the charger alone. Some chargers in "power supply mode" provide a lower voltage than when in normal charge mode. Ie, the battery can have a higher voltage than the charger supplies in "power supply mode".

Battery charger supplies a constant 13.8V DC with a maximum of 25 amps.  So I assume all load is drawn from the charger and none from the battery if the load does not exceed 25A (which mine never would).

KB

[Estelle]

Hi KB,

I may have misread cetacean's setup, but it looks like his fridge(s) run from either 12V or 240V.

[KingBilly]

Hi KB,

I may have misread cetacean's setup, but it looks like his fridge(s) run from either 12V or 240V.

    

I believe an Engel fridge uses a 12V motor and some models have an inbuilt transformer (or perhaps a switch mode power supply) to allow connection to 240V AC.

KB

[McGirr]

Another good point is there is a good opportunity to test your 12V setup. Run what you want on 12v to measure times and power consumed on your batteries. You have 240v to top the batteries back up.

I did this last year at a powered site at Easter.

Have a great time.

Mark 

[Jeepers Creepers]

Its a bit like down at the marina, for $5,500 per year for the mooring, we get power as part of that, so we are plugged into shore power at all times.

Keeps everything charged ready to go, with fridges cold etc.  To the point, we have food on board in the fridge and ready to roll.

[Herks]

Agree with KingBilly, 12 volt that way you only carry one set of anything!!

Enjoy the long weekend.

[Symon]

   

I believe an Engel fridge uses a 12V motor and some models have an inbuilt transformer (or perhaps a switch mode power supply) to allow connection to 240V AC.

KB

From memory the swing motor in the Engels have a 12V and a 240V winding, so there is no power supply to drop 240V down to 12V.

Personally I would run anything that can run off 240V off 240V.

[Estelle]

Fridge only runs on 12V DC.

KB

 

The fridge has a 12V input and a 240V input. There are usually specs for both supplies lines. The specs will indicate which draws more power.

Ed:  hence cetacean has more information to help decide which way to go.

[cetacean]

Thanks for all your responses guys. Nothing like an electrical question to get the discussion moving along !
Looks likes it's about 40/ 30 in favour of the 240 volt  And yes I have been watching the tennis

Cheers Darryl

[Robbo]

Use 240 volt mains supply

Why ??

Because you can
 


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