Author Topic: This is wrong!!!  (Read 15431 times)

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Offline becboo

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This is wrong!!!
« on: May 26, 2012, 08:51:21 PM »
Bloody Australian government !!  What crap!   

They say there is a shortage of skilled workers. 
The number of people who are skilled and want to get into the mines is crazy!  This really pisses me off ( sorry if I offend anyone ).

http://m.theaustralian.com.au/business/mining-energy/roy-hill-can-bring-1715-workers-from-overseas-over-next-three-years/story-e6frg9df-1226366861946

More like they want cheap labour!

Did I say how much it pisses me off!!

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Offline McGirr

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2012, 09:08:27 PM »

Yes its crazy and you think about getting unemployment down  ???

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crackacoldie

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2012, 11:47:53 PM »
I know that I'll get howled down for this, but here goes...

Whilst so many of the unions are outraged by this, very few of the unemployed adn/or manufacturing workers about to become unemployed, are willing to move to these remote locations.  The mining industry does struggle to get suitable workers in most remote locations.  As a mining employee who now works on recruiting new staff, we have big problems with getting people prepared to 1.  relocate.  2. do fly-in fly-out work and 3. work roster/shift work.

Until more Australians are prepared to actually put their money where their mouth is, in relation to working in these conditions, this may be the only way forward.

Just my 2c.

Offline becboo

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2012, 08:03:04 AM »
Hey Crackacoldie,

Who do you work for?  I will tell all the people I know who are willing to do all they can to get into the mining industry to give you a ring.

I know a lot of people who want to get into the mining industry, are willing to change location, or fly in and out but are unable to get past first base primarily because they don't have mining
experience.  Some of these people are tradies who just want a go, earn some dollars for 5 years so they are set.

Give some info and I will let them know.  Then Australia wins   :cup:

 :cheers:
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Offline cancan

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2012, 09:26:48 AM »
This has been on the cards for a while now.....My wife developed the rem and benefits for a foreign owned company when they entered the mining industry and they nearly had a heart attack and when they saw them.....they even questoned all the safety stuff saying that in other countries they just pay for the funeral. Anyhow they told her that they plan to bring as much staff as possible from OS and a lot of lunches with Chris Bowen later look whats happening.
Me personally I think there is a lot of brown paper bag stuff going on as this cannot be in the benefit of Australia.
Yes they will try to employ locally first but they will offer conditions and/or wages that are below par so most Australians with experience will not apply. This is already the case with the said foreign owned company.
My wife also developed a training program for green staff for an Australian owned mining company and the numbers of applications was massive, and that's without making an effort....so there is a lot of people out there looking for the mining rainbow and a lot that don't mind the travel and rosters (I fly in and out Monday to Friday and it is hard on the family(not in mining)).
Anyhow my 2 cents worth and once they have changed the rules it will be other industries that will try and cash in....a bit like how they changed the rules for foreign ownership of property.
disclaimer the above is from my interpretation of conversations with my wife which are based on her interpretations on conversations with foreign mining company ceo's and we could of interpreted the conversation wrong...but I doubt it.
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Offline D4D

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2012, 09:34:40 AM »
It is about profit and maintaining it. You send my costs up, mining tax, carbon tax, I have to save somewhere else hence cheaper labour. Pretty simple really, ALP farked the golden goose on this one.
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Offline Symon

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2012, 09:54:18 AM »
Australians have priced themselves out of the labour market, plain and simple.  You would not believe the amount of tradespeople who call me up looking for work who hang up the moment I tell them what our pay rate is.

The bubble will burst, people like Rhinehart are trying to prick it.
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Offline Doug.b

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #7 on: May 27, 2012, 10:07:24 AM »
It's the mining companies wanting to bring foreign labour in and trying to keep the unions out of the mining industry.
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/8473723/no-foreigners-in-aussie-mining-jobs-pm
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Offline BLKWDW

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #8 on: May 27, 2012, 10:17:06 AM »
Id love a job in the mines but wife isnt prepared to move to the middle of know where to do it. There is 2 mines within an hr but i cant seem to get a start in those either. (orange and parkes). FIFO work wouldnt bother me as i'm away in the truck 5-6 days a week anyways but the nearest major airport is 3hrs away to fly anywhere. Anyways i think the idea is stupid. Theres plenty of people on the dole that could be trained and relocated where the work is.

Offline Hoyks

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #9 on: May 27, 2012, 10:52:11 AM »
I've been offered mining jobs that pay more than I'm on now, but when asked is there a guarantee there will be work in 2 years, they tend to get noncommittal, So, I'll stay where I am. It is a long way to go and a very expensive place to live.

My wife grew up in the NW WA and it would be a cold day in hell before she went back, it takes a special kind of person to work there and I think we are actually running low on them.

Offline D4D

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2012, 11:23:58 AM »
It's the mining companies wanting to bring foreign labour in and trying to keep the unions out of the mining industry.

Personally I don't have a problem with that.
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Offline speewa158

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2012, 11:29:32 AM »
This could be the end of the slowly dieing Federal Govt . Got to get somebody that wants to run the country & not just their sandcastle  :'(
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Offline Big Nath

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2012, 11:30:25 AM »
It is about profit and maintaining it. You send my costs up, mining tax, carbon tax, I have to save somewhere else hence cheaper labour. Pretty simple really, ALP farked the golden goose on this one.
X2

Australians have priced themselves out of the labour market, plain and simple.  You would not believe the amount of tradespeople who call me up looking for work who hang up the moment I tell them what our pay rate is.

The bubble will burst, people like Rhinehart are trying to prick it.

Yep, honestly, can we blame her? 1700 @ award rates as apposed to 1700@ 150k+/yr

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Offline kiwipete

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2012, 12:27:43 PM »
http://www.news.com.au/national/as-australians-lose-jobs-gina-rinehart-imports-1700-foreign-workers/story-e6frfkvr-1226367752919




Personally I think this totally stinks but am interested to know what the miners think themselves...   and since there are a few of you here on this Forum you may have some comments...

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Offline becboo

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2012, 12:27:49 PM »


Yep, honestly, can we blame her? 1700 @ award rates as apposed to 1700@ 150k+/yr

Cheers!!

I think I must be missing something. Can someone explain to me why there are lots of mines that can pay "normal" Aussie mine wage yet she can't?
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Offline BigJules

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2012, 12:53:14 PM »
I am in two minds about this. I wouldn't mind having a crack at mine wirl myself, but like a few before me, I can't see my family agreeing to it. With unemployment at <5%, there really isn't a lot of people who could go and do the job. And please, don't bring out the old argument of "if people are on the dole they should go". Most of them are on the dole because they're useless pr1cks, some are just stuck where they are and there is no employment and they can't move for one reason or another. Mines don't want no-hopers anymore than you would want to woek with them. (Same argument against compulsory military service - why train a drongo to shoot people?).

My biggest concern is the cause of the drought, a skills shortage. If we import skilled workers we don't train or retain those skills here and the money leaves the country. We need to skill up. Apprenticeships are rare these days.

As for profitability of these companies, they are making good money from our collective resources. Bring on the mining tax and make sure the miniing companies themselves are paying tax, because to date they have not paid their share at all, with all the tax write offs and concessions that have been put in place.

This is not a Labor vs Liberal issue, is a today issue.
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Offline McGirr

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2012, 12:53:51 PM »
They built a unit complex in Cairns with workers from overseas that the company sponsored. It brought the costs down but they still wanted a fortune for the units.

You have to look at it from 2 levels.

The worker: yes morally it's wrong but how much is a skilled worker worth. I understand the expense living in an isolated area and the time away from family but as mentioned I think the big wages are disappearing.

The employer: they are there to make money and look at all avenues that are available to them. and bringing in 1700 workers that will cost a lot less in wages then its smart business. But i would make sure they are properly trained. If it was my busness I would do the same.

Before we all scream but they make a fortune in profit. Well so do the banks and they have shifted a lot of their business off shore.

I have never worked in the mining industry but I have dealt with a lot of workers who do in the Real Estate industry. 

The Govt needs to bring back the apprenticeship benefits for employers.

Just my thoughts but I know everyone will have their opinion.

Mark
« Last Edit: May 27, 2012, 01:00:07 PM by McGirr »
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Offline Symon

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2012, 12:58:47 PM »
I think I must be missing something. Can someone explain to me why there are lots of mines that can pay "normal" Aussie mine wage yet she can't?

The reality is that the other mines can't either, well not in the long term.  I personally am sick of hearing about the mining boom.  The boom is over, have a look at commodity prices, they have been trending down for over a year.  Miners are investing big now while there is still capital around, but don't expect it to last.
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Offline Barrabart

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2012, 01:11:45 PM »
 

There have been Aussie Labour Hire companies running recruitment adds in the Post Courier in PNG, off and on for the last 6 months, Heavy Equipment Op's that I work with are sending their CV's in. I rang the Labour Hire Co to investigate them a little further and just to make sure it all sounded legit (as some of my op's were asking me to give them a reference), their story is purely and simply that they can't get blokes with experience or desire to fill positions in WA, they were offering the work to experienced PNG nationals, they were conducting interviews in Port Moresby, those shortlisted were given the Visa application paper work etc, the recruitment guys were setting them up with accom in Aus, bank accounts etc.

So it's already happening.......

Anyway that's my 2c worth.
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Offline Barrabart

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2012, 01:29:24 PM »


My biggest concern is the cause of the drought, a skills shortage. If we import skilled workers we don't train or retain those skills here and the money leaves the country. We need to skill up. Apprenticeships are rare these days.

This is not a Labor vs Liberal issue, is a today issue.

Totally agree....... the mines only have themselves to blame, in the 12 years I worked in Aus, only at 1 mine did I see apprentices being started.... the rest only wanted tradesmen..... if we bring in tradesmen will apprenticeships cease to exist.
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Offline D4D

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2012, 01:37:49 PM »
The Govt needs to bring back the apprenticeship benefits for employers.

The decline started when they got rid of tech schools...
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Offline dooguss

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #21 on: May 27, 2012, 01:53:54 PM »
Yeh crackacoldie feel free to tell me where it is these remote mining companies are advertising for workers as like alot of Australian workers I am also trying to get into the mines and am willing to go anywhere to work. Why make it so hard to find these jobs when apparently we have a shortage of skilled workers put it out so we can all see them.
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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #22 on: May 27, 2012, 02:11:03 PM »
Yeh crackacoldie feel free to tell me where it is these remote mining companies are advertising for workers as like alot of Australian workers I am also trying to get into the mines and am willing to go anywhere to work. Why make it so hard to find these jobs when apparently we have a shortage of skilled workers put it out so we can all see them.


Click on this http://lmgtfy.com/?q=mining+jobs+australia
« Last Edit: May 27, 2012, 02:13:17 PM by time »

Offline Symon

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Re: This is wrong!!!
« Reply #23 on: May 27, 2012, 02:16:46 PM »
As for profitability of these companies, they are making good money from our collective resources. Bring on the mining tax and make sure the miniing companies themselves are paying tax, because to date they have not paid their share at all, with all the tax write offs and concessions that have been put in place.

They may not have paid much tax but they paid a fortune in royalties.  This is part of the stink of the whole resources tax thing - the federal government is annoyed the states are raking it in but not getting much themselves, so lets introduce the tax and attempt to convince the states to reduce their royalties - as if that is going to happen.  Also don't forget all the industries that support the mining sector, if the mines go into decline, so do they - it isn't just mining companies that make money out of what comes out of the ground.

I really can't get why people buy into this class war that the miners are cash up evil companies that are 'ripping us off of our resources'.  They are out to make money like any other business and to return the profits to their shareholders.  And who is the shareholders?  You and I of course, our super funds, etc.  If you ruin investment in this country you are really biting the hand that feeds.

Where the problem started was back in the 80's when there was a big shift in the attitude of state governments towards mining.  Mines at the time were doing it tough with long term contracts and a rather flat export market.  Nonetheless people like Sir Joh said to the miners "you want a mine, you build a town" which love him or hate him, was a pretty smart policy to adopt.  Sometime later the policies shifted and that requirement was dropped, all of a sudden with miners attempting to cut costs they introduced the FIFO culture - and the state governments allowed them to do it.

You can't blame the miners for trying to make money, but you can blame governments for stupid policies.
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