Best way to join snatch straps !!

[Mace]

Jas,
Point taken, however I was only using the words 'rope' and 'cable' as I could think of no other word that could be used as an 'extension lead' or 'extension cable' or 'extension rope' that made any sense in showing it was an 'extension' of the attachment on the vehicle and not another snatch strap.
I have a 8mt polly rope as my 'extension strap' if required because of the inability to stretch, unlike nylon rope.

A steel 'rope' or 'cable' would never be considered for the reasons you have nominated 

Gday Mainey,

Ive been doing a bit of googling today looking at Black Snake Products (Straps & strops) and trying to understand how they behave.   

Your strap - like mine, has inbuilt metal receivers at each end, designed to attach to rated recovery points of an equal breaking strength. It would seem that in most applications, you purchase a various lengths to suit your  needs, from 6m up to 40 plus).

From what Ive deduced, it is best not to attach you black snake to another snatch strap. Behaviour of the black snake is known (relatively), not the other strap in the time of breakage.  Attachment to another non elastic equivalent rated extention strap seems to be fine - by whatever suitable method shown previously.

The issue to me is that the metal receiver ends in the black snake straps are the higher mass in the combined  link and may be perceived as a potential projectile because they are metal, although low mass.  Its interesting that the black snake "strops" do not have any metal in them, just fabrick, and would seem to be a lower projectile mass.

In direct relationship to this, from what Ive read, If a black snake strap breaks, the end receivers on the metallic straps  DO NOT travel very far if the unit is tested to breaking point.  They are recorded as coming to ground between 2 and 4 metres away from the point of break (depending on strap length), because of the higher physical density of the material and construction type (radial coiled) they are made of.

So, we've got a great piece of gear, but we  need to be mindfull of what ever we attach up to if extending their range.  I tried to post up a link, but couldnt find it on this PC, maybe 2morro.

Cheers,  Mace.

[briann532]

OK...................
Thanks for all your replies.

To set the scene, I was arguing with some people over whether to use one or not.

I was of the opinion that ÿes"you can as long as you take the rating of the lowest item.
In this case the extension strap.
If using a 12,000 pound snatch strap joined to an 8,000 pound extension strap, then your max rating would be 8,000 pound.

I was also of the opinion that if you joined 3 or 4 straps together to give you the required length, you'd have a lot of elasticity to take up during the snatch.

I was argued against with the opinion that you cant use an extension strap because it had no elasticity.
Of course not, but that is the role of the added snatch strap.
Say for instance you have one of those overpriced recovery hooks in your hayman reece - is that not a static extension of your towbar. Is not the block in the hitch an extension?
Where is their elasticity?
They are a static object connect to the elastic strap.

I have no problems using a winch strap as long as it is in line with a snatch strap. It is really just extending the recovery point............

I acknowledge it is my opinion, but I believe it to be an educated correct one.
lord only knows what will follow, but from these posts, I can safely tell these blokes to go rebury their heads in the mud!!!!

Cheers
Brian

[McGirr]

As mentioned it all depends on the predicament you are in. As Symon mentioned we were snatching across a creek which is the easiest recovery. If the vehicle was bogged then this situation would have to be analyzed and depending what recovery gear is available and the safest way to recover the vehicle.

Mark

[Mace]

Sand, not mud!!
Ive also been looking at smileys 2day!!

 

[Maîneÿ . . .]

I was of the opinion that ÿes you can as long as you take the rating of the lowest item.
In this case the extension strap.
If using a 12,000 pound snatch strap joined to an 8,000 pound extension strap, then your max rating would be 8,000 pound. yes

I was also of the opinion that if you joined 3 or 4 straps together to give you the required length, you'd have a lot of elasticity to take up during the snatch. yes

I was argued against with the opinion that you cant use an extension strap because it had no elasticity.
Of course not, but that is the role of the added snatch strap. yes

Say for instance you have one of those overpriced recovery hooks in your hayman reece - is that not a static extension of your towbar. Is not the block in the hitch an extension? yes it is
Where is their elasticity?
They are a static object connect to the elastic strap.

I have no problems using a winch strap as long as it is in line with a snatch strap. It is really just extending the recovery point............ yes

I acknowledge it is my opinion, but I believe it to be an educated correct one. I agree with you 100%
lord only knows what will follow, but from these posts, I can safely tell these blokes to go rebury their heads in the mud!!!!

Could not have said it any more correctly - I also believe your 100% correct 

As a test of the 3 x strap situation:
get 3 x large rubber bands, join them together, and see their kinetic energy release when compared to just 1 x rubber band 
(for the test 3 x RUBBER BANDS won't break your bones)

[meimarocu]

OK...Flame suit on...

My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.

If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.

Cheers Ian.

[Mace]

OK...Flame suit on...

My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.

If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.

Cheers Ian.

I, for one agree.

[Chippy76]

OK...Flame suit on...

My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.

If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.

Cheers Ian.

Very true Ian ... although it would not do a great deal of damage to the snatch strap ...
Cheers Chippy

[Maîneÿ . . .]

OK...Flame suit on...

My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not meant for towing.

If you tow, say across a river use a extension strap.

Yes, X 2

I also agree with you

[Jason B]

Jas,
Point taken, however I was only using the words 'rope' and 'cable' as I could think of no other word that could be used as an 'extension lead' or 'extension cable' or 'extension rope' that made any sense in showing it was an 'extension' of the attachment on the vehicle and not another snatch strap.
I have a 8mt polly rope as my 'extension strap' if required because of the inability to stretch, unlike nylon rope.

A steel 'rope' or 'cable' would never be considered for the reasons you have nominated 

No worries sorry about my rant.

I just wanted to be sure we weren't talking about a steel cable. One of my staff was bogged and was recovered by a good Samaritan, however they used his recovery gear which included a steel rope, the one of the eye's of which let go and the lot went through my guys windscreen. Could have been a real ugly end (will try and find the photo tomorrow) to a days work.

Regards


Jas

[jaycamrie]

For everyone to understand our predicament last year at the Cape was when we were crossing Nolan's Creek. 3 vehicles got across but the next 2 did not and got stuck coming out. No problem there as 1 single snatch strap was used.

The other problem was 6 other cars were on the other side. The crossing was about 15 meters wide and up to the headlights in depth. We used 3 straps joined together so that we had enough length for yogi to get some speed up and get the cars across. All safety measures were discussed and all non essential help was well away from the action.

I was the sucker in the water with the hand held giving directions and getting soaked when the cars hit the water. We got everyone across but the straps were too hard to un do even with joiners we had which were ones I think JK had.

Mark
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Wouldn,t  it  be easier to tow across with a extension strap (20M) if the creek  is only 15 metres wide rather then snatch into water then across a creek 

[jetcrew]

In reality we only used the snatch straps because we needed the length.  We could have used extension straps instead, taken up the strain slowly and then got Yogi to floor it.  But to be honest I really don't think it mattered, there wasn't that much strain on the straps (we weren't really recovering, just merely giving the vehicles a helping hand through) and I'm pretty sure the only reason the straps bound up is because the join slipped a bit so that the bit of webbing we had in there didn't do its job properly.

More a bit of bad luck than bad technique in my opinion, happy to be told otherwise though.

Fully agree with the above , it would not have mattered what type of straps were used they would have still bound up.  From what I have seen and heard you guys did a bloody good job getting all the vehicals through , if one strap had to be cut after all was said and done it was a top effort .at $80 each i'd be happy to sacrifice a strap to safley get 20 vehicals through chest deep water with campers on.

Might be a good spot to use all our old straps if its just a pull through.

Jet  

[McGirr]

For everyone to understand our predicament last year at the Cape was when we were crossing Nolan's Creek. 3 vehicles got across but the next 2 did not and got stuck coming out. No problem there as 1 single snatch strap was used.

The other problem was 6 other cars were on the other side. The crossing was about 15 meters wide and up to the headlights in depth. We used 3 straps joined together so that we had enough length for yogi to get some speed up and get the cars across. All safety measures were discussed and all non essential help was well away from the action.

I was the sucker in the water with the hand held giving directions and getting soaked when the cars hit the water. We got everyone across but the straps were too hard to un do even with joiners we had which were ones I think JK had.

Mark
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Wouldn,t  it  be easier to tow across with a extension strap (20M) if the creek  is only 15 metres wide rather then snatch into water then across a creek

We used what we had as we were holding up other vehicles and I am not sure if we had an extension strap that long. Too long ago

Mark

[duggie]

I carry a 30 metre spare soft Dyneema winch rope with me. It can be used as a winch extension or if needed a tow rope. And that is where MC Girr is coming from at the Nolan's crossing. The snatch straps were been used as a tow rope. I was allready at the Jardine when the rest of the Myswag group done Nolan's otherwise if I had been with them I am sure we would have used my spare winch rope for pulling the vehicles across.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Dyneema-Winch-Rope-Sk75-Synthetic-Cable-9mm-x-30m-4WD-Recovery-Offroad-Warn-/160744377443?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item256d1c8c63

Cheers duggie

[Symon]

OK...Flame suit on...

My opinion is,
If your bogged you use a snatch strap for the energy.
Snatch straps are not ment for towing.

If you tow,say across a river use a extension strap.

Cheers Ian.

In general I would agree with you, but there was nothing wrong with what we did up the Cape.  There wasn't that much strain on the straps when Yogi was pulling people through.  Another thing to consider is if we were using winch extension straps, if the vehicle did somehow get stuck halfway through we would have to back up and change to a snatch strap.  Not exactly the kind of thing you want to do when your vehicle is in the creek with water coming in.....

I really think we are over analysing this one guys.

[Chippy76]

Low speed towing (such as what I imagine would have happened at Jardine - I wasnt there) should be no issue for a snatch strap. Bear in mind that they are rated at a higher value than ordinary tow ropes or straps (winch ext or otherwise). So the idea of using them to tow through water should be no issue. There is little to no safety issue, as the water is "containing" the strap in event of failure anyway.

Cheers Chippy

[BigJules]

At the risk of prolonging this, I can't see why a snatch strap would not be suitable for towing? The elasticity is still beneficial, taking the jolt out of start or slack, plus you only get the sling shot effect when you apply plenty of force, quickly, which one does not if towing correctly.

The only issue I see is that they're too long in most cases unless doubled up several times, to stop them dragging on the ground.

[McGirr]

I think I have got the answer I wanted as we seem to be focusing on what people would use and their opinions ( which is good ) 

Mark

[Symon]

At the risk of prolonging this, I can't see why a snatch strap would not be suitable for towing? The elasticity is still beneficial, taking the jolt out of start or slack, plus you only get the sling shot effect when you apply plenty of force, quickly, which one does not if towing correctly.

The only issue I see is that they're too long in most cases unless doubled up several times, to stop them dragging on the ground.

I've been told they have only so much 'spring' in them before they are stuffed.  So if you use them for towing they are being stretched pretty much constantly (although not as much as in an recovery) shortening their life.  Having said that though they are great for towing as the bit of give in them makes starting off much smoother.

[meimarocu]

In general I would agree with you, but there was nothing wrong with what we did up the Cape.  There wasn't that much strain on the straps when Yogi was pulling people through.  Another thing to consider is if we were using winch extension straps, if the vehicle did somehow get stuck halfway through we would have to back up and change to a snatch strap.  Not exactly the kind of thing you want to do when your vehicle is in the creek with water coming in.....

I really think we are over analysing this one guys.

I agree it would be a location situation..

ian.

[fishfinder]

join them with a domestic cat it works a treat

[VKPrado]

Not sure if mentioned before.

Was watching a DVD last night and they used a toilet roll inbetween the two snatch strap. Just a different way of doing it.

[briann532]

join them with a domestic cat it works a treat

Why am I smiling??

[Hairs]

join them with a domestic cat it works a treat

Why not a feral one, they'd be tougher.
 

[GeoffA]

Why not a feral one, they'd be tougher.
 

....too hard to catch.......