Author Topic: Sand bogs and what to do?  (Read 6939 times)

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Offline Mungoman

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Sand bogs and what to do?
« on: October 02, 2011, 06:06:21 AM »
Well, thanks to some great advice here I bought my AWB compressor c/w gauge and AWB deflator.
Fantastic!  So I hit the beach for some beach fishing, travelling through  some extremely soft, dry and boggy sand on the narrow entry road.  No problemo for the Prado on 15psi. But yesterday I came across a stranded party on the narrow road in a shiny black Quatro kind of suburban thingo (sorry didn't get the name/model).  She was bogged to the doors -- and I guess the chassis (if it had one). And they're trying to let the tyres down with a stick.  So I gets out with my new AWB deflator and immediately lowered my voice to an authorative, all-knowing tone, and took on rescue operations. "We'll just lower the tyres, dig out the back wheels and you'll have to reverse out of there (downhill)," says I.
But when the driver tried to drive out only the front wheels would turn.  I says, "Isn't this a 4WD?" and he says, "Yes."  So I says, "How come only the front wheels are turning?" And he says, "It's computerised!" 
My wife was still giggling way into the night when I told her that the computer decided not to cooperate with the rescue.
So my first question is, would this have been a real 4WD or one of those AWD thingos?  And my second question is, because the vehicle was too low to the ground, do you virtually have to dig the thing out with a shovel?
No one had a tow rope so I couldn't assist there. So after about 30 minutes I had to give them the number of the local servo that tows out beach-bogged vehicles. I felt very helpless. 
So what are some of the tricks in getting something like this out of a sand bog -- and are there similar sand bogs that even the high body 4WDs can't get out of?

Offline D4D

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2011, 06:24:05 AM »
There should have been a button/switch to alter the power output to 50/50 front/rear. Most of these AWD vehicles are typically FWD biased.
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Offline Gunna Do

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2011, 07:37:32 AM »
If everyone had Maxtrax this sort of thing would never be an issue.

Personally I wouldn't be game to try and tow a vehicle like that.  The chances of some sort of damage I think would be high.

Give them a loan of your shovel, and tell them to clear all the sand out from underneath the vehicle, and this combined with lower tyre pressures might do the job.  If you can find the magic button to make all four wheels drive that is.

Offline GU Rich

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2011, 07:46:35 AM »
Like GD mentioned, clear as much san away as possible. I know that SteveandViv spent 1.5 hrs digging out there Paj one night up near Cape Leveque I think it was. It sounds like a long time to be digging but they had no choice and it worked.

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Offline Chippy76

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2011, 08:00:56 AM »
I booged an army unimog once ..... a Mack wrecker couldnt even pull it out :s  It took 6 hrs of digging and two macks to finally free it!

Sometimes digging is the only option.

CheersChippy :D
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Offline Patr80l

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2011, 09:05:04 AM »
Advice I have gleaned from a Touareg forum is that in sand you turn off the electronic stability control (includes traction control).   The Touareg has a centre diff lock so it wouldn't suffer the same problem as it's cousin, but it seems that you can turn off "the computer". Well, bits of it.
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Offline austastar

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2011, 09:49:41 AM »
I booged an army unimog once .....

Awesome!

Some people have all the fun.

cheers

Offline Brett B

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2011, 10:01:32 AM »
Advice I have gleaned from a Touareg forum is that in sand you turn off the electronic stability control (includes traction control).   The Touareg has a centre diff lock so it wouldn't suffer the same problem as it's cousin, but it seems that you can turn off "the computer". Well, bits of it.
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Offline Nomad

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2011, 10:05:26 AM »
Has anyone ever used one of those exhaust jacks for this reason? They look like a PITA. All the photos I have seen for marketing have been of a small 4wd on grass..........If it did work at least it would make it easier to dig sand out.

Offline Squalo

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2011, 01:18:21 PM »
It can even happen to 'real' 4WDs - the traction control senses that a wheel has started to spin, so it 'solves the problem' by braking that wheel... Discoverys are known for it, although I believe LC has made changes on later models to address this.

I just wonder what possesses people to drive softroaders into sand with no idea of how to do it, and no way of recovering the vehicle...
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Offline SteveandViv

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2011, 01:48:37 PM »
Like GD mentioned, clear as much san away as possible. I know that SteveandViv spent 1.5 hrs digging out there Paj one night up near Cape Leveque I think it was. It sounds like a long time to be digging but they had no choice and it worked.

 :cheers:





Thanks for reminding me Rich  ;D Like you say. We were up the far end of Cape Leveque with 18psi in low 4WD. Even with the front locker we just sank down as the sand is very fluffy. We needed to get the sand away from the side, diffs etc and the resulting pic is the hole we left. I also let the tyres down to 5 psi and once we had cleared the sand away simply reversed out..

Oh and the MAXTRAX were back at camp - opps

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Offline Swogjb

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2011, 02:09:42 PM »
I just wonder what possesses people to drive softroaders into sand with no idea of how to do it, and no way of recovering the vehicle...

Not only softroaders.
We have a lot  of great beachs and sand hills down our way that we can drive on.
Long weekends and holiday periods you will always come across bogged to the arse 4wd's with very green drivers behind the wheels. It sometimes make me wonder what the f@&k must go through the heads  of some people. Bolt a sand flag to the front of the ARB and they think they are invincible.
Boxing day last year we snatched 3 vehicles out in about 10 k of beach. All had way to much air in the tyres and were allergic to using a shovel.
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Offline Squalo

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2011, 03:09:27 PM »
TV ads for Pathfinders and Foresters have a lot to answer for  ;D
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Offline Crisp Image

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2011, 04:10:54 PM »
Every time I see this heading I think it says sand bags :-*
Which reminds me you could use a dozen sand bags filled with um.......sand and well placed after a dig and this would provide a stable surface to drive on. and they have a multitude of uses around the place too.
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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2011, 04:14:49 PM »
Every time I see this heading I think it says sand bags :-*
Which reminds me you could use a dozen sand bags filled with um.......sand and well placed after a dig and this would provide a stable surface to drive on. and they have a multitude of uses around the place too.
Regards
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Offline Chippy76

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2011, 05:02:12 PM »
Awesome!

Some people have all the fun.

cheers

Sadly it was mid-deployment, at midnight :S So it made for a long cold muddy night!

I have a bit of a rule about recovery, If I turn up and someone isnt helping themselves (either shoveling or at least providing a snatch strap) I wont even bother.

I once stopped to help a guy at Fraser who had bogged his pathfinger to the chassis. The normal deal, no shovel, no strap, too much air in tyres..... I stopped and hooked up my strap to him , but after 3 pulls in VERY soft sand. I abandoned the attempt. On walking back to his car I noticed the wife and kids where all sitting in the car. Not one of them got out to help. We told him that we were in a bit of a hurry to try and miss the tide , apologised and left him there ......

If you arent going to help urself, why the hell should I help you ?????

Just my thoughts ......

Cheers Chippy :S

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Offline rescue1

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2011, 05:57:48 PM »
Just be careful how you pull those things out. One reason my X-Trail has a recover hitch on the rear, no chassis means no points to mount rated recovery points.....

Offline Mungoman

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2011, 07:19:05 AM »
Ok, so carry a shovel and a strap and maybe Maxtrax or sandbags. All good.
Re Chippy's point: As I risked my back to push while the wheels spun, I noticed that I was the only one pushing and 4 people were standing by.  I said, "You've got to push." They did but with seemingly little effort.
An amusing aside to this is that the party of 5 were Chinese (students my guess) -- I've got a Chinese techo mate and I recognised some of the lingo. So when I finally told them about the local servo that would tow them out (about 10Ks away) they all reached for various pockets and compartments, and out popped five iPhones, and an intense session of Googling commenced.
After a while I said, "Why don't you just call 'information' -- they'll even connect you?" But that was old technology, so the Googleathon continued.  That's when I made my exit.

 
   

Offline kylarama

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2011, 07:46:43 AM »
5 years ago while up at Kakadu we were heading to Jim Jim Falls the day after it opened (last croc removed).  On the last 5km stretch of the sandiest part of the track we came across a rental Rav4 struggling, eventually it got stuck and the driver had his foot burried flat digging himself to the doors.  Stopped and got out to discover a Spanish couple with ZERO english, turn to my well traveled partner and ask her if she knows any Spanish?  To which she replies "dos cervezas, por favor"  "great" I say "what does that mean?  "two beers please"!

First thing I do is air down their tyres.  Well the look on the blokes face when I start doing this was priceless, it was that look of you're going let my tyres down and leave me stranded you bastard!  A quick shovel and snatch had them out and then they followed us in.  I tried my best to explain to him he needs to pump his tyres back up once back on tarmac... 3 days later I see them on the highway with about 15psi in the tyres still!

And he did help me.  Extremely enthusiastic on the end of the shovel and rolling up the snatch, all while wearing nothing but leopard skin speedos. :o

Offline Patr80l

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2011, 08:15:21 AM »
Me to driver of bogged rental, after noticing only the front wheels were spinning; "Have you locked the hubs?"
Him; "Wot?"
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Offline Mungoman

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #20 on: October 03, 2011, 08:24:34 AM »
5 years ago while up at Kakadu we were heading to Jim Jim Falls the day after it opened (last croc removed).  On the last 5km stretch of the sandiest part of the track we came across a rental Rav4 struggling, eventually it got stuck and the driver had his foot burried flat digging himself to the doors.  Stopped and got out to discover a Spanish couple with ZERO english, turn to my well traveled partner and ask her if she knows any Spanish?  To which she replies "dos cervezas, por favor"  "great" I say "what does that mean?  "two beers please"!

First thing I do is air down their tyres.  Well the look on the blokes face when I start doing this was priceless, it was that look of you're going let my tyres down and leave me stranded you bastard!  A quick shovel and snatch had them out and then they followed us in.  I tried my best to explain to him he needs to pump his tyres back up once back on tarmac... 3 days later I see them on the highway with about 15psi in the tyres still!

And he did help me.  Extremely enthusiastic on the end of the shovel and rolling up the snatch, all while wearing nothing but leopard skin speedos. :o


Well the ol' Babel Fish says it's, "Bombee para arriba los neumáticos."  I'm sure that's going to come in handy...one day.
Maybe not as handy as "dos cervezas por favor". 
Many years ago I was working at a Spanish Day festival and was surprised that I could understand some of the ground announcements because I'd worked in the Philippines and spoke some of the lingo of the former Spanish colony.
It was thirsty work so I cobbled a few words together and headed for the beer tent where there was a guy working flat out with his head down doling out beer from the ice boxes. So I says, "Una cerveza por favor Amigo," and blow me down he hands me a beer and takes the money without even giving me a second look. So it works! So far I can ask for a beer in 7 languages: English, Filipino, Spanish, Chinese, Vietnamese, German and Italian. Where's this thread going?

Offline SteveandViv

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #21 on: October 03, 2011, 08:37:30 AM »
Me to driver of bogged rental, after noticing only the front wheels were spinning; "Have you locked the hubs?"
Him; "Wot?"

But if the front wheel were spinning and even if it had hubs but they don;t then they would have to have been locked already to spin. It will be like any AWD vehicle where the centre diff is not locked or at a pinch uses a viscous coupling.

Even though the Paj has a centre diff lock I can still run it isn AWD using a viscous coupling which allows us to run it in 4WD all the time. On ours it's a 60/40 split and great on dirt. But when push comes to shove the wheel with the least traction out of the 4 will spin. My bet is that's what happened here
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Offline Patr80l

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Re: Sand bogs and what to do?
« Reply #22 on: October 03, 2011, 09:47:59 AM »
But if the front wheel were spinning and even if it had hubs but they don;t then they would have to have been locked already to spin. It will be like any AWD vehicle where the centre diff is not locked or at a pinch uses a viscous coupling.

Even though the Paj has a centre diff lock I can still run it isn AWD using a viscous coupling which allows us to run it in 4WD all the time. On ours it's a 60/40 split and great on dirt. But when push comes to shove the wheel with the least traction out of the 4 will spin. My bet is that's what happened here

You're right.  It's an old story and I got the details wrong.    The hubs weren't locked, he didn't know what I was talking about, and the front wheels were idle while the back wheels were spinning in the mud.   I got it muddled in the re-telling.   With unlocked hubs (even on one side only) the front wheels would not spin.
By the way, the vehicle in my story was a rented Suzuki Sierra and did have locking hubs.   The Audi (no locking hubs) was the OP's story.
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