Solar Panels the house, 1 year on, the results

[Garry H]

Hi all,
12 months ago I lashed out and installed 24 x 180 panels on the roof = 4.32 Kw
paired it up with a sunny boy inverter (4Kw) and had it all installed by one of the bigger companys here in Adelaide
I could have had a cheaper system installed but some companys with shorter warrantys and invertors made in China/Taiwon etc don't sit right with me
my all up out of pocket cost after the rebates (at the time) and the import/export meter was $16,000,
keeping in mind here in SA we get paid for feeding into the grid net @ .44c (.52c with AGL) ie during the day we use from the panels and only get paid for the excees we feed in.
in the first 12 months
the inverter produce 6300 units, we fed in 3725 units, and used from the grid 3200 units
our previous electricity bills were somewhere around the $3-400 mark per 1/4
by my caculations we have now had about a 16% return on our money taking into account credits & electricity used
and am thinking at the current electricity prices and useage we will be looking at around a 6 year payback, less as electricity prices go up. (if the rules stay the same with feed in tarifs etc)

anyway i am happy with the whole setup, I realise that different states have different feed in rules and there is a lot of variables.....
are you happy with your setup and have you "crunched the numbers" on you solar setup?
I would be interested to hear you numbers and opinions on solar
cheers
Garry

[McGirr]

Garry

Interesting to read as I was going to do the same a while ago but the price was out of my budget.

Here in Cairns a large number of homes have solar but as a real estate agent resale value on a home with solar does not unfortuantly recoup the cost of installing it as a large number of properties are re sold every 4 to 5 years and alot of buyers do not see value in solar. May be in the future this will change.

Just think in 6 years you will have free power, hopefully. Well done.

Mark 

[albany_nomads]

I recently just put on the basic (8 panels) with a 2.2 kw inverter (room to add a few more panels at a later date), and I was also able to gain the 47 cents a unit credit here in WA. (cost $4000 out of pocket after rebate to install)
Theres only two of us and as such we are at work during the day, kids have left home, Albany WA has  fairly mild summers so not a great call for Air Con, we have a few appliances on timers so they only come on after sunlight hours.
By doing all this we are able to max on power going into the grid and min the amount to run stand by.
At the moment I reckon I will save approx $650 to $700 in power per year at the present cost with the way the invoices are showing.

$4000.00 at a savings account interest rate of lets say 4% would only return me $160.00 per year.
So the way I look at it I get a better return on my money in electricity savings for my $4000 investment that what I would with it being in the bank at 4% as an example.
Now although my unit is no where near the size of Garrys and as such Im still a net user of grid power it is reducing my power bill quite considerable each invoice
And like you said Garry with luck will be paid for in approx 6 years.

[WilSurf]

Same here.
We bought the then "big" 1.5kW system 3 years ago.
The power bills now are around $60 per 2 months.
We had 1 bill of $8.65 CREDIT. which was the best ever.
I am changing over all 50W halogen spotlight to 9W LED spotlights.

[WilSurf]

At the end of this the last payment from the Department of Energy will be paid to us.
Out of pocket it was $9500 3 years ago, but wereceived $4500 from the DoE which makes it $5000.
Happy family.

[watto11]

Hey guys I'm getting a quote next wk to install solar we use a fair bit of power with pool and aircons in summer so looking at getting 4.2kv system hoping it will cost approx $15,000 no more anyway fingers crossed decided to do it as we r refinancing Mortage and will add it on otherwise out of my budget. So here's hoping for no power bills in future

[Maîneÿ . . .]

The best way to recoup your money fast is to feed the most you can back to the grid during the day, and use power at night, so your paying 12c at night but getting paid 40c during the day.
Yes, I realise this will not suit everyone, but if power usage can be modified it works out quiet well and you would get your money back sooner than you expect.

For smaller home owners in just months and you have no more power bills, and your starting to get repaid for your investment based on the smallest Gov re-batable system.

(using examples here in WA)

[morgue]

We have been reemed good and proper here in NSW, we had a solar industry...ain't got one any more, the government cried poor an the power companies screwed the bejesus out of the new NSW government, saying they could not afford the cost. They can afford the cost of new infrustructure though!
I was half a bees ball off buying a system, but did'nt at the last minute...so far I am toying with turning the lighting system to a complete 12v LED.
Good luck to you blokes who have made the change and are reeping the rewards.
My next joint will be completely off the grid, a nice barn shed on a couple of hectres... the complete systems are getting cheaper and cheaper.

[blackstump]

We put 8 panels Put on the roof in June. 1.5kw. Had a 3kw inverter installed with them so as to add to it later on. We are still waiting for sp ausnet to come and change over the meter......not happy. Seems the sparky didn't do his paperwork properly so he had to re issue it or something. So still waiting and still not happy

[Bill]

We had our 2.4 K system installed almost a year ago.
40 Kaneka Panels


5k Sunnyboy inverter (in case we ever decide to add more panels)



With Morag and I both working all day and only using power in the evenings we are more than happy with our investment.
We have also put the pool on the economy terrif thingy...
Bill and Morag

[peteandkyles]

You might be interested in this
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-09-30/solar-feed-in-tariff-threshold/3193684?section=sa

SA sets solar payment threshold

Updated September 30, 2011 15:23:37
ETSA will set a threshold on the sum paid for power fed back into the grid Photo: ETSA will set a threshold on the sum paid for power fed back into the grid (ABC News)

The South Australian Government has declared a crackdown on solar energy generators it says are profiteering from its feed-in tariff.

ETSA Utilities will review customers' accounts to identify people who are putting large amounts of electricity back into the grid, but are consuming little or no power.

The minimum consumption will be 400 kilowatts per year, the equivalent of leaving a light on.

SA Energy Minister Michael O'Brien says he expects less than 1 per cent of customers who have installed solar panels will be affected by the measure.

"This is more to deal with individuals whose sole intention is to generate electricity for the purposes of profiteering the system and I think the outcome this benchmark of running an electric light bulb is an extremely fair proposition," he said.

[Variflex]

I purchased a 2kw system through Solargen just over two years back, When my system was installed there was no feed in tariff just a net system, for those few months the system basically halved my bill,for me it was a bit of a risk but then the 60 cent gross feed in tariff was announced and that was a big win us and a risk that really paid off, I  have been graphing my power generation since I started recieving the feed in tariff and have shared the data with friends and family, some of which have taken the plunge and bought a system aswell.
 
I find it funny that people have shyed away from solar now there is not a feed in tariff scheme available, at the end of the day it may take a little longer to pay itself off but it's money your going to spend anyway, may aswell be paying off a solar system than just paying coin to your electricity retailer.

As i am in NSW bear in mind that these comments are based on the happenings. feed in tariff's in NSW, solar tariff's vary state to state

[Manjimike]

Some good points there Variflex
 

[Bill]

We are locked into a 5 year contract to buy back our excess electricity @ $.45 per kilowatt (or whatever unit of measurement they use).
So even if after 5 years they reduce the buy back payments or, if they stop paying for the power altogether, we will have our system paid for so we will still be ahead.
Well that is our thinking anyway...
Bill and Morag

[Captain]

I am glad those who have put solar are happy with it. I too looked into it but couldn't get the numbers to add up. While some of the provided calculations looked good, I factored into it our daytime use of power, interest cost etc... and it took some 20 years to break even. But if your power usage makes solar economical, then go for it.

Other studies I read on the web had similair conclusions on poor payback, but so much depends on how you use the power. We have a relatively high day-time use so this affects payback in a big way. Also, changing halogens to LED's and incandesant to fluro was shown to be more cost effective than solar. So those already on solar will be able to make even bigger savings by simply changing your lights.

As the price of panels and components change, it will become cheaper to install. But power grid saturation is starting to occur in some areas already and is one reason I believe the solar credits / export power payments were lowered and has decimated the solar industry at the moment. Unfortunately it really was a necessity as you can only pump so much power back into the grid.

Cheers

Captain

[Apollo]

I opted years ago (when the rebate scheme was first announced) to go with a company that was installing a 1kw system for the rebate amount as I figured I had no payback period and was getting the benefits from day one.  My bill has reduced about $100/quarter based on my system generating 4.5-5kw per day and about 0.5-1kw been feed back into the system each day.  The saving is further enhanced when you factor in the large price increases in electricity we have had in that time.

I recently considered the option of putting in a 30kw system, but the QLD govt changed the rules in June to max out at 5kw.  So much for this being the smart state!  Where is the incentive for private sector to invest in green energy and contribute towards the reduction of greenhouse gases, etc?  If they were serious, they would be encouraging it.

Steve

[Symon]

Garry

Interesting to read as I was going to do the same a while ago but the price was out of my budget.

Here in Cairns a large number of homes have solar but as a real estate agent resale value on a home with solar does not unfortuantly recoup the cost of installing it as a large number of properties are re sold every 4 to 5 years and alot of buyers do not see value in solar. May be in the future this will change.

Just think in 6 years you will have free power, hopefully. Well done.

Mark 

How do you go with rental properties Mark?  Since the rebate is given to the owner of the electricity account (ie, the tennant) does it make the property more desirable for rent?

Just thinking about it for our investment properties.

[Nomad]

Symon,

As Mark said, most people aren't "adding value"for them when purchasing a home. So I doubt the rental market will look at it to closely, or will you get the benefit of additional rental for having it installed, at this stage. That being said though,you are obviously able to DIY it, at probably a substantial discount to retail price and still get a rebate on it.

On a longer term view however, the market will, albeit slowly, come to view them as a substantial positive, just look at water tanks and how they have become desirable with the high price of water these days.

I am at this stage questioning the life span and obsolescence of these systems,some manufacturers are giving 25 year warranties on the panels, and I am not sure about the inverter, do you think that they will last this long? It appears the ATO is allowing them to be depreciated over 20 years.

[Bill]

Our sunny boy inverter has a 25 year warranty, along with the rest of the system. I would be  surprised if these companies were still around in that time...
Bill and Morag

[austastar]

Hi,
   the Govt. still has a 'gotcha' if they do similar to our local Water Supply Authority has managed to do.

They can charge the full network fee for water connection if it runs past your property, even if you don't have a pipe connected to the mains.

I imagine that if enough houses were independent of the grid similar moves would be made.

When USA had the huge power brownouts years ago, the Yanks went mad on saving electricity to the point that they saved so much, the utility companies had to raise the unit cost of electricity to raise sufficient funds.
Con Edison became one of the first big companies that every body over there loved to hate.

cheers

[Mungoman]

Yep, we looked at it too.  Apart from not trusting any govt as far as I could throw a grand piano, I still feel that the technology is not quite there yet. I'm sure future generations will look at those huge banks of solar panels like we look at those early mobile phones the size of housebricks or the early PCs (like my first PC), which had a whopping 100MB hard drive and a whopping 4MB RAM.
As for the previously mentioned governments, when oh when will the punters wake up  that these carbon taxing, planet saving spin doctors don't give a monkey's about the planet.  What could be more 'planet saving' than solar power?  But they're pulling the plug on it as fast as they can. In the meantime they don't seem to mind Orica dumping its carcinogenic deposits all over Newcastle -- with just a naughty boy rap on the knuckles and a continuation of their 'honesty system'.
Meanwhile the Bowen Basin coal mining project is set to tripple NSW's Hunter production.  Yep, we're really moving to cleaner power.

[McGirr]

How do you go with rental properties Mark?  Since the rebate is given to the owner of the electricity account (ie, the tennant) does it make the property more desirable for rent?

Just thinking about it for our investment properties.

It depends on the rental market. Here in Cairns the rental market for houses is strong so having solar would not make any difference. In a slow market it may get you a tenant over another property. Have a depreciation schedule done and claim them over 5 years on either diminishing value or prime cost.

Mark

[Noelpolar]

I factored in a replacement inverter every 10 years when doing my sums....... I was once an electrician and technical officer........also I always project conservatively when modeling financial matters.....I installed a system similar to the ordinal posters thread..... 4Kw SMS inverter..... 14 235w panels and also a 30 tube 315ltr HWS (Apricus).

I just retired so was cashed up.. $18k all up.... In my experience the price is soon forgotten but the pain of power bills lasts a lifetime......and with the basic incompetence throughout all levels of government, on all sides,  the pain will just continue on it's current path......

You do really need to be sure that your likely to stay in your house for a while...... And definitely keep the ascetics of your house in mind..... If applicable!

Symon,

As Mark said, most people aren't "adding value"for them when purchasing a home. So I doubt the rental market will look at it to closely, or will you get the benefit of additional rental for having it installed, at this stage. That being said though,you are obviously able to DIY it, at probably a substantial discount to retail price and still get a rebate on it.

On a longer term view however, the market will, albeit slowly, come to view them as a substantial positive, just look at water tanks and how they have become desirable with the high price of water these days.

I am at this stage questioning the life span and obsolescence of these systems,some manufacturers are giving 25 year warranties on the panels, and I am not sure about the inverter, do you think that they will last this long? It appears the ATO is allowing them to be depreciated over 20 years.

[UIZ733]

2.1KW ($7000 out of pocket) system with 2.5KW Latronics inverter, approx. 18 months. Annual power bill saving $1100 approx. Return on investment %15.00 approx. Wish my super fund was achieving 1/3 of this return!

[jetcrew]

The best way to save money on your power bill is use less....

It is great to hear that some people are getting good results out of thier systems.

For me personally in my situation the sums do not add up.

Although the GOVT mandates buy back till 2028 it does not mandate a trarrif amount.

Power companies are laughing like the fat kid who stole the cup cakes.

They get the green creditinals but you pay for the infustructure , good to see some people factoring in replacment componets because it will happen.

Try change your power company ...it will be alot of fun. Some people are being rejected from larger systems as the power grid cannot handle the loads coming back in. the recs credits max out at 1.5kw then tapper down this is to make the 1.5kw systems the best $$ wise and the power companies would be happy with everyone putting 1.5kw on as it still means you will BUY alot of power.And they still claim a % of green energy is produced. Ask weather it's the power generated or the system size that is used to calc the % of green energy the power company claims they have.

If the power companies start to loose profits due to solar they will reduce the tarrif amount. Once they meet thier requirment under the govt arrangment for % of clean energy they will also reduce tarrifs.


Please do not take this as a solar bashing post I think it really does work in some cases but they are few and far between IMHO. Power company CEO's and the GOVT sit down to nut a solar industry . I know who I think got the better deal.

Pardon the pun but make hay while the sun shines .As it may all change before your eyes.

Thats just my opinion and does not represent any qualified position.

Jetcrew