Towbar- towball weight, help

[paull]

Yeah, my Dad has towed caravans in Europe for 30 years or more. 100kg ball weight on a family sized caravan would be classed as normal there, and far less on smaller vans. 150kg would be classed as heavy, even on big vans. He was amazed when I told him about the 10% rule here and that we would realistically expect over 100kg ball weight on a camper trailer and the van we're getting could have a ball weight up to 300kg when loaded. That would just never happen in Europe.

As an aside, quite ironically the 150 series Prado he has (the series 1 with thd 3l diesel) is rated to tow more in Europe than it is here. Go figure!

[oldmate]

It's about weight v axle placement v # of axles.  Where are the axles on most rear fold or forward fold campers? And where is all the storage?

[jmsaintpierre]

Hi guys,

well, still no answers from audi.. Not surprising.
As for new truck, i d love it, but at this stage, we need a luxury suv for my wife work. I have company car, so buying a 4x4 just to tow 6 times a year, is a bit unrealistic.
Buying a range rover, thank you but no thank you....
Options are really disappearing fast..
I guess, i can always get a chinese camper/tent as i believe they are lighter than the aust ones...hahaha
I see a lot of lifestyle campers for sale, some quite cheap some quite expensive.. Turns out though they are lifestyle trailers, they are a import tent...
Here i was getting all excited, at the price when i saw lifestyle campers . Thought that all lifestyle were 100% aust, then i thought i d double check...
 

[GeoffA]

It's about weight v axle placement v # of axles.  Where are the axles on most rear fold or forward fold campers? And where is all the storage?

Yes, where IS all the storage??

[oldmate]

On a ff and Rf most in front of the axle I would of thought?

[GeoffA]

On a ff and Rf most in front of the axle I would of thought?

Yes, but I think you've missed my point ollie....

[McTavish]

I think you will find that it depends on the model of Lifestyle trailer - Going from memory now - but I think the Walkthrough model would likely be their imported tent - I can tell as it's a bit 'shiny' (and usually a lighter coloured blue) compared to the usual ozzy canvas.  Still pretty good quality.  The Extender & the 360 being their all local product? 

What threw me off the walk through model was seeing it in the flesh.  It's huge and heavy.   Just the offroad wheels/tyres are mini truck like.    We had a Subaru Fozzie at the time which would have been a real concern as she'd be struggling to pull it off the drive.   

What you may find is that some of their earlier models with the smaller trailer (not walk through) like the Explorer Plus may have lower tow ball weights.

Or - Maybe seek out a Jimboomba camper - most of these had aluminium trailers which would be lighter (well the tub at least).  Or aim for a Tourer model Customline.   If concerned about tow ball weight then avoid the imports with huge fridge and storage boxes forward of the axle.   

We also have the 9ft tent which saves on overall weight too.   And easier to put up and down.

Good luck with finding out your limits...

[jmsaintpierre]

Hi Mctavish,
Thanks for the heads up.
Indeed the lifestyle seem huge. I have found a few and will go and check them out this week end. I also, have just now discovered jimboomba traikers, thanks. Love the aluminium look. Will definitely try and see if there s one around me.
Looking for a quality second hand trailer is a bit harder than I thought. A good Aus one is about $6000-$8000, but I can can a custom line entry level for a little above $10000. They have a special on where you either choose the electric set up or full annex wall and floor. Which really makes it hard.
Thanks anyway..

[oldmate]

So back to where you said you only camped 5 or 6 times a year.

How do you currently camp? I assume tents etc etc?

Why not buy a box trailer and load that to cart your gear for the 5 or 6 camps you do?

Then you have a box trailer you can use for the rest of the year? 

Unless you want to start making those 5 trips touring trips then my suggestion is sell the Audi. Lol.

Food for thought!!

[Peeb]

You are stuck with 100 kg. It's the way things are going. Car manufacturers aren't going to spend a fortune to engineer their cars to cope with poor/lazy designed Australian behemoth caravans and imported campers. (If you tried to install a washing machine in the back of a caravan in Europe they would point, laugh and probably imprison you in a Brussels gaol).

Either change the car, or look at Ultimate or Outback Sturt/Newell depending on how far off road you want to go. The Newell is 55kg on the ball. Sturt would be a bit more but well under 100 kg. There may be a few others. Mountain Trail / Complete Campsite (proper well engineered Aussie trailers) are still around the 130 kg mark. Many of the rear fold imports are stupid heavy/chassis bending.

There are a few manufacturers/importers who are slowly twigging onto the fact that there are about 5 times as many SUV's out there as there are proper 4WD. You may notice some models being advertised as "SUV friendly" ie ball weight below 100 kg. I suspect this will continue until all vans and trailers are built to lower ball weight specs like they are in Europe. Who needs a heavy spec off-road trailer/van if your car can't go off-road? (obviously that doesn't apply to most on this forum)

You will also notice that Bailey bring their light weight, central mass Euro van over here and then make them heavier so that Aussies will buy them. I'll let Bailey tell you if that's done for marketing purposes or due to genuine engineering concern. I suspect the former, but I'm no expert. Just a cynic.

[jmsaintpierre]

Hi guys
Thanks for rall the advice, really appreciate it.
Finally hear from Audi .
Audi genuine towbar fitted with wiring harness $2600. Rated at 2000kg/200kg.
Absolutely fantastic, it opens more door to the buying of a camper.
Also rang around to compare prices, one was $895 fitted, and told me to simply disconnect the sensors when reversing with trailer.
Another towbar installer, supplying and wiring Hayman Reece , $2100.
So my thoughts are for the extra $500, may as well go with Audi genuine parts to cover all bases in case of worst case scenario.
There are talk at work that instead of leasing Car we may start buying them, which I would then negotiate if I could upgrade at my cost for a 4x4 instead of the current ranger 4x2 high ride we have.
Save me buying a whole 4x4 and have it sitting in the drive way for most of the year.
So happy with the reply from Audi.
Now I can really focus on getting a camper and my second dilemma - being new vs second hand.
Like I mentioned in one previous post, for a couple of thousands more than second hand one, I may as well get a new.
Just talked to jimboomba trailer and there entry level, is $10000. It s suits my need, don t want anything fancy. I already have a fridge, 2 x 80ah batteries, solar panel, generator, toilet +tent.
My other option is getting a PBL off road trailer for $2800, kitchen for $700, and a walkabout or custom line tent and annex roof for $4500 and m set.
So hard to make a decision..
Thanks for all your help guys anyway. Very much appreciated.

[Peeb]

That's great news and a bit of a (nice) surprise.

Definitely go with the genuine Audi tow loom - you can get the Hayman Reece bar if you want the square tongue reciever for a bike rack etc but stay away from their electrics solution. All the HR module does is stop the car going ape when you hit the brakes which confuses the ECU into thinking a bulb has blown. It may also cause your boot to randomly open as it did in our Passat.

The VAG setup will change a whole load of parameters in engine mapping and cooling, gearbox mapping, ABS, stability control as well as the doot-doots when reversing.

Two further pieces of advice: stay away from the guy who said to disconnect the reversing sensors. He has no idea what he is talking about. He just wants your money. Secondly, have a squiz in the manual at the towing section. Specifically as to whether the tow loom calibrates the ECU to work with over-ride brakes. It probably will say that - other VAG cars definitely do. It doesn't mean you can't use electric but it begs the question. If you aren't doing serious off-road I'd stick with what the manual says - over-ride brakes.
Good luck.

[KingBilly]

Hi guys
Thanks for rall the advice, really appreciate it.
Finally hear from Audi .
Audi genuine towbar fitted with wiring harness $2600. Rated at 2000kg/200kg.
Absolutely fantastic, it opens more door to the buying of a camper.

Great news    See reply #2 

Have fun looking for a camper

KB

[paull]

Wow. Didn't expect that. That's great news.......but $2600 for a tow bar . And I thought Jeep used to take the p1ss with their official accessory prices on my old JK. Clearly Jeep weren't trying hard enough. Audi really know how to extort their customers.

[gronk]

Was going to suggest upgrading to a Q7, as I saw one today towing a 20ft Jayco Basestation !!

If you go the official track, make sure you get paperwork .