Diff lockers

[achjimmy]

I had a rear locker in the Paj and only used it a few times. Going up monument track once I used the traction control for half and locker the other half. It certainly wasn't a hard core 4x4 track, and was doable without either. But I felt the Paj was more "confident " wih the locker engaged. I guess the Shiter the conditions the better the locker would become? Definetly look at them on a ute.

[weeds]

OK, I'll play dumb.  If the vehicle has traction control won't that stop a wheel spinning?  Are diff locks redundant with traction control?  Asking as I am about to buy a dual cab and all of them have traction control these days but I notice the Ranger/BT50 still have a lockable rear diff - obviously for a reason.  Could somebody please enlighten me?

KB

Somebody might be able to exam better than me.....

With TC you need to loose traction before it cuts in (the technology is getting better) and each time the brakes are applied to the spinning wheel only one wheel can be driving...., lockers provide positive drive to a four wheel all the time although steering can be affected

Once you have a selectable locker this negates your TC once engaged

[alnjan]

http://www.arb.com.au/getting-started/ask-arb/air-lockers/060%20Air%20Lockers%20vs%20traction%20control%20devices.php

To try and describe Traction Control v Diff Locks in words is difficult compared to driving and seeing the difference.

But apart from all of that, more importantly is to know why you are getting diff locks or want them.

For the majority of people and their uses Traction Control will be enough.  Diff Locks just let you play harder, which a lot of people are not into.  If you like your 4wding go for it.

[D4D]

For the majority of people and their uses Traction Control will be enough. 

Agreed

Diff Locks just let you play harder, which a lot of people are not into.   

Disagree, diff locks provide you with a heap more traction therefore you're able to drive much slower and have more control than using lots of momentum that may brake other things.

[Symon]

Going on a Cape trip shortly and wondering if they would be a benefit.

Getting back to the original question, for the Cape a winch is far more useful than lockers.  Since you already have the winch, save your money and buy more beer.

[DSzuke]

I haven't driven in TC equipped cars much but have driven on lockers a lot.

IMHO, TC's biggest downfall is you have to first loose traction for it to kick in.

This can take some getting used to as most novice 4wders first instinct is to back off if they start spinning wheels when in fact what they need to do is keep spinning the wheels until the TC catches up and decides that it needs to work.

The wheel spin required seems to be at least half a turn on most TC systems (I could be wrong there), this can't be good for the "Tread Lightly" savvy people amongst us.

Lockers however don't rely on the traction being broken first. Much more control as well as less wheel spin = less track damage.

[achjimmy]

I haven't driven in TC equipped cars much but have driven on lockers a lot.

IMHO, TC's biggest downfall is you have to first loose traction for it to kick in.

This can take some getting used to as most novice 4wders first instinct is to back off if they start spinning wheels when in fact what they need to do is keep spinning the wheels until the TC catches up and decides that it needs to work.

The wheel spin required seems to be at least half a turn on most TC systems (I could be wrong there), this can't be good for the "Tread Lightly" savvy people amongst us.

Lockers however don't rely on the traction being broken first. Much more control as well as less wheel spin = less track damage.

You'd be a very talented driver to always pick the spin before the TC picks it. In most cases in the Pajero the only reason you knew the traction control was working was the ligth would flash

[Ricey]

Very interesting reading.
I have an Auto Locker for the Patrol sitting at home.
Will be fitting it next month when I have the time.
Let you know how it goes.

[KingBilly]

Thanks folks.  Appreciate the explanations.

 
KB

[Rob C]

Getting back to the original question, for the Cape a winch is far more useful than lockers.  Since you already have the winch, save your money and buy more beer.

Lots more Beer !!!!!

[Turbojohn]

I am a big fan of being twin locked!  Do you need them? Probably not untill you find yourself in a very tricky situation.
I have found that much less momentum is required to get through difficult tracks especially with a camper in tow.
Having diff locks allows you to crawl over obstacles slower with less stress on driveline components therefore less chance of damage. As said earlier though when you do get stuck you will be much deeper in the s@#t than without them. I certainly recommend them to anyone who uses 4wd regularly, and when your truck just walks up pretty much anything leaving the others floundering around behind, you'll be wagging your tail like a dog at dinner time

[DSzuke]

You'd be a very talented driver to always pick the spin before the TC picks it. In most cases in the Pajero the only reason you knew the traction control was working was the ligth would flash

yep... fair call. I'm certain the technology has become very sensitive (and effective). 

You know thinking about your comment, I've realised I've watched more traction control cars off road from outside the car so seen them spinning rather than felt it from the drivers seat.

I'm not in any way saying I'm an expert, just been around long enough to proudly say "I like the old-school, give me lockers any day".

[camperd4d]

ok,I have just fitted a Eaton front Elocker,and a rear Eaton Detriot trutrac geared LSD,see-> http://www.eaton.com/Eaton/ProductsServices/Automotive/AutomotiveAftermarket/Differentials/index.htm

Im going to the cape in 4 weeks as well and hoping to do the creb track and alot more so thought these would be a good investment for this trip.

 After some testing on the weekend togeather with new BF G mud-terains  they work unreal (my car actuall drove up a near  vertical rock wall on saturday) this is coming down that same wall,i know it doesnt look that bad in the pic,I can asure you it shouldnt have been as easy as it was. My toyota rear LSD was still fairly tight ,and would of easly done the cape  without the rear trutrac but It was in the workshop so i bit the bullet and got it fitted before the toyota LSD wore out. As they do.


,In all honesty I dont know why people dont just engage them when the track looks extremely rough before they start doing damage to there drive train,often you see people strugle and bounce up rocky mountains and then get completely stuck ,THEN engage there locker..............why not save your diff,drive shafts,tail shafts engage before hand and just crawl up the rough stuff with ease.

oh and the reason why i went Elocker was I dont like paying for  perished o-rings to be replaced every couple years or less,or replace airlines etc.. as several guys I know are with there airlock diffs.

[Brumbypt]

If you do the creb track then yes get a locker, air locker..

Otherwise get one anyway, cos they save ya tyres, vehicle and the track..

But the tele cape track, probably wont need it.. But get one anyway..

Arb air locker only..

[letsgo]

Great pic camperd4d

Well you are all pretty convincing, we have a quote from ARB and will call into Opposite Lock for a quote on E Lockers

[Diesel Power]

I have twin Prolockers made by TJM, the reason is that Toyota factory rear LSDs are junk and the front locker is to protect my front CVs.
Regards
Angus

[Brumbypt]

Wouldnt a front locker put more stress on the cv joints.. Especially if you floor it while turning the wheel and one suddenly gets traction..

[camperd4d]

Wouldnt a front locker put more stress on the cv joints.. Especially if you floor it while turning the wheel and one suddenly gets traction..

no ,quite the opposite as when under load with an open diff one wheel will spin in the air and when it come back in contact with the ground you can shear the CV,drive shaft in half given enough force,its does happen quite abit.
A locker will have both wheels turning at the same speed and usually the same speed as the vehicle is traveling as well (if you doing it right),so when the wheel drops down less load will be on the drive train.

[alnjan]

Agreed

Disagree, diff locks provide you with a heap more traction therefore you're able to drive much slower and have more control than using lots of momentum that may brake other things.

I think you may have misinterpreted my meaning of going harder.  I was referring to 4wding harder, not driving harder.  In that regard the diff locks allow you do as you state, drive slower with a lot more control then using momentum.  Not the best examples as I don't have many shots of my trucks playing

[GraemeL]

I have a Dmax, am I better off to get front and rear or just go with the front? Also idea on the cost, I know this will vary from vehicle to vehicle, but a ballpark figure.

[letsgo]

Ha ha alnjan, don't think we better do that with the trailer in tow

[Diesel Power]

no ,quite the opposite as when under load with an open diff one wheel will spin in the air and when it come back in contact with the ground you can shear the CV,drive shaft in half given enough force,its does happen quite abit.
A locker will have both wheels turning at the same speed and usually the same speed as the vehicle is traveling as well (if you doing it right),so when the wheel drops down less load will be on the drive train.

Thank you, for the reply
Regards
Angus.

[letsgo]

Hi GraemeL,

Quote we got from ARB last weekend for the Colorado, much the same as the Dmax.

Front Airlocker, ISUZU $1077
Bearings x2 $80
Labour $600
Total $1757

Rear Airlocker ISUZU $1119
Bearings x2 $80
Labour $450
Total $1649

Compressor Kit, medium air lock $290
Pump Kit $55
Airline Exhaust x2 $30
Labour to fit  compressor $200
Total $575

We wouldn't get them to fit the Compressor as we already have one and hubby, Chris is going to install it himself. He could actually install the lot it's just a matter of time for him. When we get the quote for the E Lockers will also post that for you

[GraemeL]

Thank you very much for providing the info, it's appreciated and I would be interested in the price for the E-lockers.

I would still like to know if it's worth the expense for front and rear or just the front or just the rear. if anyone could shed some light on that it would also be appreciated.

[camperd4d]

OK I paid to have both mine fitted $3150.00, included bearings ,fluids,reshimming front/rear.

Front Elocker $1863.65 +gst
Rear trutrac $1000.00 +gst

That was done at opposite lock narrellan store last week.