Non-genuine battery with higher voltage for camera

[WilSurf]

We have a JVC HD video camera and the original battery is running down from full to empty i 5 minutes.
So I have to get a new one.

The manual tells me that the voltage is 7.2V and I think 780 mAh (BN-VF707U)
They also mention the bigger battery BN-VF733U which is 3300mAh.
On the web I can find these, however the cheaper ones are delivering this at 7.4V in stead of 7.2V.

Does it damage the camera if the 7.4V is being used or is this the newer technology?

[fuji]

Mate I can't help you on the tech side bit I have bought non genuine for video cameras, cameras and they aren't worth crap. They just don't keep a charge after awhile. So now I buy genuine batteries only.IMO
 
fuji

[WilSurf]

But $16 or $60 is a huge difference.

[BigJules]

I've had reasonable success with after market camera batteries for PnS jobbies.

I'd give it a go.

[Bird]

But $16 or $60 is a huge difference.

theres a reason in the difference

I can get Canon 5D batteries for $160 or copies for $40, the copies are now absolute Shit. for a few charges they were good. I've got 4 of them

I've just got some more genuine ones.

YMMV

[Marschy]

If they are lithium ion then  7.4 will make little difference. 7.4 volt Lithium ion batteries are charged to 8.4 volts to fully charge them.

If the original is 7.2 volts they are probably not lithium ion, possibly nicad or NiMH. You'll get better life out of lithium ion batteries.

[prodigyrf]

You'll get better life out of lithium ion batteries.

Actually NiCads will give better life, are more robust and tolerate extremes of temperature better. Apart from being heavier per volt they  need to be in cylindrical modules whereas Lithiums can be any convenient shape and Nicads will suffer from memory effect unless run right down. That's where NiMH batteries come into their own but trading off some of those top NICad benefits. Full up full down for longevity means a second charged battery for swapping which is no problem with say cordless power tools, but obviously a pain with resetting comms equipment.

It's rather sad to see mobile phone batteries lying in full sun on a dash or car seat, let alone being charged while copping that extreme heat when you know how fatal that can be. As to price for performance, batteries aint batteries and neither are their charge requirements as you'll quickly discover from the best resource on the net if you're interested here-
http://batteryuniversity.com/
Test your knowledge and some of the old wives tales you've picked up from largely ignorant users. 

[Marschy]

Sorry but this is bollocks. The vast majority of people use their camera then put it away after use on the shelf or back in their camera bag without fully discharging the battery, whether they are lithium ion or nicad or NiMH.

Stick your hand up if you diligently fully discharge your nicad batteries.


As memory effect is the biggest killer of nicad batteries, you would have to assume that most people, including me, don't maintain their batteries correctly.

Ergo, a battery where you don't have to worry about memory effect will, for the average punter who doesn't maintain batteries correctly, I.e. lithium ion, last longer than a nicad battery.

[Bird]

Stick your hand up if you diligently fully discharge your nicad batteries.

'The 1DS charger does this for you and/or recharges..
The charger is worth diamonds.

[Marschy]

But your not an average punter Lost you have invested a lot of money in your equipment, including your charger, obviously.

[SteveandViv]

Sorry but this is bollocks. The vast majority of people use their camera then put it away after use on the shelf or back in their camera bag without fully discharging the battery, whether they are lithium ion or nicad or NiMH.

Stick your hand up if you diligently fully discharge your nicad batteries.


As memory effect is the biggest killer of nicad batteries, you would have to assume that most people, including me, don't maintain their batteries correctly.

Ergo, a battery where you don't have to worry about memory effect will, for the average punter who doesn't maintain batteries correctly, I.e. lithium ion, last longer than a nicad battery.

Yep. Never, ever discharge my batteries in the camera or any thing. Have the same battery for 7 year now on our SLR -eExactly as you say. Take a shot, put it in the bag and then get some where and go - sh1t, forgot to charge :-)

Now though I am better at throwing it on the charger before I go away cause the wife said so.

[prodigyrf]

No Marschy, the biggest killer of Nickel based batteries is self discharge and when left discharged they'll crystallise and quickly become useless, albeit like my Hilti tool charger and Powerex MHC9000 (for AA and AAA batteries) they do have a rejuvenation function. Nevertheless Ni batteries will fail if left discharged for long which is why they're not suitable for intermittent use, as many a handyman discovers with that cordless tool that's only used a couple of times a year.

Sanyo solved that shortcoming with their Eneloop lattice batteries that hold their charge (90% over 6 months and 85% over 12 months) There are a number of manufacturers providing such 'pre-charged' batteries nowadays and you're a mug if you choose standard Ni batteries for intermittent use over them.

Bear in mind Li batteries also self-discharge but they don't like operating below 40% charge anyway and makers like Hilti cut your power tool dead at that level requiring charging. No probs with 2 or more rapid charge batteries and that's the quality you pay for (try $350 on for size for a new 36V Li batt for the lad's TE7A rotary hammer) In fact that's how Toyota guarantee their Prius battery for 8 yrs by only running it at 40% capacity. Full up and full down with total electric vehicle batteries and longevity is the number one problem, just like your mobile phone batteries which are getting tired after a couple of years.

[WilSurf]

Yep, using the camera every now and then.
So the 0.2V, does that make any difference?

[prodigyrf]

Yep, using the camera every now and then.
So the 0.2V, does that make any difference?

The care and charging of your Li battery might make more difference to overall functionality than some maximum initial specification-
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries
Then take a dekko at some of the relevant articles down that LHS menu. For most consumers they can't be bothered with such technical stuff, but when you're in the business of having to shell out big bucks for professional battery tools you sure get interested rather quickly.

Horses for courses and take expensive tradey vs cheap handyman battery tools. The cheapies taper off immediately you begin using them and take ages to charge whereas the tradey stuff keeps working at a maxm plateau until it dies within a couple of teks or drill holes and then it's a fast 15-20 min recharge. As I said in the case of some Li battery tools like Hilti the tool stops dead at a certain minimum voltage/charge anyway. Then the charger has a cooling fan and a temp cutout if the battery gets too warm when charging. You watch some tradeys cursing at why their expensive Li battery won't charge on a summer stinker in the bright sunshine and just shake your head at their ignorance. As for leaving Li batteries in summer sunshine through the car windscreen... Yikes!

[jeeps]

I've read up on the batteryuniversity.com website and hear all the claims about li-ion batteries but in real life experiences of mine, they last longer if I at least try to discharge them all the way between charges. Even the manufacturers recommend complete discharges every 3-4 charges. The whole argument of "li-ions don't have memory" is false. My camera, laptop, portable DVD players, phone batteries etc are all li-ion and I discharge them completely every chance I get, even if it means I will hve to without it for a bit, but i'm fairly prepared and have spares or portable chargers. My iphone 3g is 6 years old with original battery, and I still get 4-5 days between charges (when I don't used Bluetooth and internet often). My camera battery is 4 years old and performs flawlessly (thousand of photos between charges). I also have a number of li-ion batteries for my fancy torches (18650's and 14500's) and once again I discharge them completely because they last longer and have better capacity long term. I paid too much for those 18650's to ignore them.

I also do the same with my 90 or so Eneloops to ensure long life.

I short, no matter the chemistry, I completely or almost completely discharge my batteries every cycle and keep them fully charged in storage where I rotate them. I've got a lot of spensive batteries I like to keep in tip top shape. I do have smart charges and charge properly, that makes a big difference too.

As to the ebay cheap batteries, you get what you pay for. However Battery World have a large range of their own branded aftermarket batteries for camcorders which are comparable to original batteries. Maybe check them out.

cheers

[theflyingbadger]

My iphone 3g is 6 years old with original battery

iphone 3g - introduced on June 9, 2008.....


4.5 years old max....

[Malcolm Tugless]

I think it depends on the usage ... when i photograph surfing I'll chew through batteries and memory cards ... I've got a few non-genuine batteries ... they seem to perform just fine ... maybe not for as long as the real deal ... but just fine ... lenses on the other hand are all genuine ... horseshoes for courseshoes.

[jeeps]

iphone 3g - introduced on June 9, 2008.....


4.5 years old max....

That's odd seeing as I got it in 2007... hmmm maybe i'm out a year or so...

[prodigyrf]

That general findings of Cadex are certainly not dogmatic simply because as they note, there are too many variables affecting battery performance. In that sense jeeps your experience may well be valid for the reasons stated. Firstly you don't ever fry them, store them chrged and use quality chargers and in that regard your full up/down cycling may not be as detrimental as others may continually overcharging with their batteries stuck in cheap chargers (computer USBs and cig sockets for starters). Overcharging is detrimental to longevity by all accounts.

With quality battery stuff like Hilti you're immediately aware manufacturers have spent a fair bit of technological effort on their chargers as well as their battery technology and no doubt the two go arm in arm. Li batteries can explode under the wrong circumstances and hence OEM stuff has top shelf protection unlike some cheaper substitutes not built to specific Standards.


Time for the battery abuse story and if you live long enough you'll cop it all and beat this. A few years ago the lad tells me he wants to buy a mate's van and some gear because his mate has gone up on the rigs. Now the van had a busted window and a few other cosmetic issues and had been laid up for some months but was in good mech nick before being parked. So I went and jump started it and yep the mech was good and we worked out the cosmetic costs of repairs and the deal was done a week or so later and can you help me pick it up dad.

When we got there the uni housemate had already removed and stuck the battery on charge on the verandah. Apparently the battery was less than a yr old and could be OK so he'd helpfully charged it overnight for us. Well have you ever tried to connect a battery that has been reversed charged because if you haven't you're in for a shock and a bloody good head scratch until you work it out. I had to use a second multimeter and hitch up a 12V fluoro trouble light to be completely convinced what bright spark had done.

All my mech mates were gobsmacked too but there was more and I'm a waste not want not sorta bloke. If a relatively new battery can be reverse charged, can it be brought back again? First problem I recognised was I couldn't just chuck it on the charger without first discharging it completely. So that evening I hitched it up to a bilge pump I had and left it running in a bucket of water, fully expecting it to be flat in the morning. Nope. It ran all the next day and was still running when I went to bed the next night but was finally flat the next morning. Charged it for a good 48 hours and it ran in the van for over 6 months before it died and was replaced. True story, believe it or not.