MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: areyonga on January 14, 2014, 10:21:33 PM
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Saw this on Facebook tonight, another one off the market :'(
"To those who might not notice, XTRAIL was closed down and ceased operation as from 22nd Dec 2013 due to financial difficulty. Thanks for those who support XTRAIL camper trailers and products. It was really a hard decision to close down XTRAIL but that is the only option we have. We apologize for no longer be able to provide further service to owners of XTRAIL campers.
As founder and designers of XTRAIL campers, I sadly see it stops this way without other option. I will try my best to find further opportunity to bring XTRAIL alive in future at my reach.
If any of our knowledge and experience could help you, please feel free to message me.
Sam"
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I was looking on their web site a couple of days ago. There was no mention of closing down on their site.
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Its a shame the steel part of his trailers was quite good but he had quite a few other things going against him in this climate. He was innovative and tried several different areas of the market but sadly it hasn't worked for him.
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I too saw the FB post about their closure just after it was posted..
hope its just a FB hacking, tired of seeing aussie companies closing up..
is the camping trailer boom over or are these trailers just too expensive, and are people now buying cheaper campers possibly from china etc.
Peter,
iPad with IOS 7.0.3 using Tapatalk HD
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I think it is all of the above.
Australian companies, regardless of what they make, need to streamline their manufacturing.
Holden, Ford, and how many camper trailer have gone bust or about to go bust.
Look at Germany, their cast of living and wages are on par with Australian costs, yet they make some of the best gear in the world.
Look at VW, they manufacture a lot of models, Holden make one.
Camper trailer manufacturing in Australia will soon end. When the average uneducated consumer can buy a MDC with everything for under 20k, where does leave the local companies.
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But Germany's population is 80 million, and Europe's is 750 million...they have a much larger customer base than Australian manufacturers!!!
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Look at Germany, their cast of living and wages are on par with Australian costs, yet they make some of the best gear in the world.
Look at VW, they manufacture a lot of models, Holden make one.
Vastly different scenarios. Germany is in the middle of Europe with an immensely larger population, read consumer base. Australia is an island, with expensive shipping, and a small population. Australia has the most challenging automotive market in the world. And I think Holden make more than one model ;D ;D
KB
Gee, you have to be quick ;D ;D
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Oh, sorry, the legendary Cruise. The modern day Camira's. I didn't want to bring that up.
What about the exports of their vehicles to around the world. It will still cost to ship here if we were to ship there.
I used them as an example. We have the know how and the technology, we just don't use our own smarts.
Holden made a great product, very limited exports. If they broaden their horizons, and looked outside their own bogan market, they could of had a great export.
Camper manufactures are the same. If they took the time out to make a product that the market wants, not bend us over the barrel for a tent on a trailer, then they wouldn't be in the poo they are in now.
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I read on here somewhere that there are 130 different brands of camper, caravan etc going around. Many of those brands get by with only a small number of sales each year. Take a walk around the Rosehill camping show and you will get the idea.
As such, I wouldn't be worried if a small number of them shut up shop from time to time as the market will replace them via supply-and-demand. Remember that we don't know why xtrail closed, just that it was financial. That could mean just about anything. Its certainly not the end of an industry.
I think caravan and camper manufacturing is right for Australia. Its a relatively simple product but can have a high level of design and integrity. There is little low-skill labour needed, most of the labour is "craftsman" level. We can produce many different grades and variations of the product, its built for purpose, highly customised and it can be done smart and stylish. Car manufacturing is the exact opposite of all of this. Car manufacturing is completely derivative, high volume, high overhead, lots of low-skill labour needed. We will never compete in car manufacturing because as KB said, we are a tiny isolated market with low turnover.
Australia does have a future in manufacturing, we've just got to focus on the right sort of manufacturing: specialist, simple design, customised, high-skill, detailed, high tech, profitable through low volume ie camper trailers and caravans. Other similar areas include mining equipment, military equipment, marine, aviation etc. That's what we should be making, not bloody cars.
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Australia does have a future in manufacturing, we've just got to focus on the right sort of manufacturing: specialist, simple design, customised, high-skill, detailed, high tech, profitable through low volume ie camper trailers and caravans. Other similar areas include mining equipment, military equipment, marine, aviation etc. That's what we should be making, not bloody cars.
That's right goose, but the skills sets and trades need to be taught somewhere, specilised industries are too small to provide this. That's were companies supporting auto manufacturing came in they trained up lots of tradies, like the governments of the past did with railway workshops and public works depots. They all trained people with little thought to a ROI. Today everything is costed to the tenth. The nation will dumb down as a result.
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I was looking on their web site a couple of days ago. There was no mention of closing down on their site.
it does now, shame as Sam was active on here a long time ago.
We regret to inform that XTRAIL Campers (Websam Solutions P/L) was closed down and ceased operation as from 22nd Dec 2013 due to financial difficulty.
We deeply thanks for all who supports and follow us through the years. Unfortunately, we apologize that we will not be able to service you anymore.
Intellectual properties including brand name, trailer designs, tent design, suspension design, website etc. have been transferred to another business and solely on their discrection if any future development.
Please check this website on late Feb 2014, the new owner of XTRAIL campers intellectual properties shall annouce their decision on the continuity of camper trailer production and development.
Websam Solutions P/L (XTRAIL Campers)
but says reopening... doubt it
Manufacturing in this country is just not viable
You cannot compete with wages and rents as they have overseas.
What Aussies earn a day, other countrys *MAY* earn a month... Its just not going to happen. Unless you pay up the wazoo for your products - and as you can see
Go through this list that hasn't been updated in years, but how many of these don't exist anymore
http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm (http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm)
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it does now, shame as Sam was active on here a long time ago.
but says reopening... doubt it
Manufacturing in this country is just not viable
You cannot compete with wages and rents as they have overseas.
What Aussies earn a day, other countrys *MAY* earn a month... Its just not going to happen. Unless you pay up the wazoo for your products - and as you can see
Go through this list that hasn't been updated in years, but how many of these don't exist anymore
http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm (http://www.campertrailers.org/manufacturers.htm)
That's it in a nutshell , well said.
Cheers
Disco teddy
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Lost is on the money I think.
We are driven by consumerism. Check out how many first timers say they are looking for a CT to enter the market and some of us point them in the direction of quality aussie built ones in myswag for sale and still they buy cheap budget imports.
The tambo that has been for sale for a while on this site sums it up. When that one doesnt go in a week you know there is an issue. A top aussie brand, well priced and top quality just sitting there while the budget ones sell. Crazy.
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The tambo that has been for sale for a while on this site sums it up. When that one doesnt go in a week you know there is an issue. A top aussie brand, well priced and top quality just sitting there while the budget ones sell. Crazy.
x2
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The tambo that has been for sale for a while on this site sums it up. When that one doesnt go in a week you know there is an issue. A top aussie brand, well priced and top quality just sitting there while the budget ones sell. Crazy.
x 3
... and as the seller says, people are calling him with interest, but ask why his is more than a new Tambo...
Are the new owners of Tambo only doing Chinese trailers now as they are selling for chinese prices or they are taking lots more than a huge one in the ginger for the team on every sale...
I'd love to update to a Goldstream, but know I'd get 1/2 a steaming pile of Shit for my trailer which I'm not prepared to lose.
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Lost is on the money I think.
We are driven by consumerism. Check out how many first timers say they are looking for a CT to enter the market and some of us point them in the direction of quality aussie built ones in myswag for sale and still they buy cheap budget imports.
The tambo that has been for sale for a while on this site sums it up. When that one doesnt go in a week you know there is an issue. A top aussie brand, well priced and top quality just sitting there while the budget ones sell. Crazy.
And would I buy another cheap import again in lieu of a 2nd hand Aussie built one ? YES I would.
I am not presuming to speak of other owners of Chinese CT's on this forum but I am sure in most cases they would affirm that they would agree with me and buy Chinese again.
Just like the owners of Aussie built CT's on this forum will never buy an imported CT. So what! Each to their own. I am a bit tired of this "us and them" attitude from OZ made to Chinese made CT owners. It doesn't make me any less Australian to own a Chinese CT.
After spending $$ on mods to my Chinese CT it owes me less than $14k. A new Kimberley or Cub equivalent would cost at least $20k more than mine.
Is the KK and Cub a better quality and better built CT than mine? Absolutely.
Are they both $20k better quality and better built than mine? No way.
I could have spent the extra $$ on the OZ made version or kept the $$ in my bank account. I chose the latter.
According to some members of this forum, owners of imported CTs are responsible for local CT manufacturers closing their business. That is the same as saying that anyone on this forum who has bought anything but a Commodore is responsible for Holden closing its doors.
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Sad to see any Aussie company go, XTrail were one of the companies we looked at when researching campers, but ended up going with Tambo at the time.
x 3
... and as the seller says, people are calling him with interest, but ask why his is more than a new Tambo...
Are the new owners of Tambo only doing Chinese trailers now as they are selling for chinese prices or they are taking lots more than a huge one in the ginger for the team on every sale...
I'd love to update to a Goldstream, but know I'd get 1/2 a steaming pile of **** for my trailer which I'm not prepared to lose.
Re the new Tambo Campers. They are not doing cheap chinese campers. From their new web site http://tambocampertrailers.com.au/ (http://tambocampertrailers.com.au/) a new Cooper is $10,990 and an Omeo is $24,990. There is a mob doing a chinese trailer that they call a Tambo, which is causing confusion.
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it is a poor financial choice to purchase a new poor quality chinese one compared to a 2nd hand quality oz one for a simple reason;
if you pay $6k for a 2nd hand tambo it has fully depreciated. You should be able to sell it in a couple of years for close to 100% of purchase.
if you pay $6k for a chinese one then it depreciates so that it is worth maybe 60% of purchase.
This is not snobbery but common sense. Like my prado. I bought it 2nd hand after depreciation for 50% of new value. Could have bought a brand new Great Wall x220 for the same value. But, once again, an inferior product ready to depreciate like crap.
But hey, do whatever you like in our wonderful sweet free country.
Have a hug in the meantime :cheers:
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There is a mob doing a chinese trailer that they call a Tambo, which is causing confusion.
Exactly, there was one for $3000...
EDIT: MADE BY Make: Ezytrail Camper Trailer
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/kilsyth/camper-trailers/tambo-se-camper-trailer-with-mt230-tent-package/1035944891 (http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/kilsyth/camper-trailers/tambo-se-camper-trailer-with-mt230-tent-package/1035944891)
Interesting the address (1/97-107 Canterbury Road, Kilsyth) given on the ad there, on google streetview is Playforce Australia - Kids playground gear.
http://playforce.com.au/ (http://playforce.com.au/)
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it is a poor financial choice to purchase a new poor quality chinese one compared to a 2nd hand quality oz one for a simple reason;
if you pay $6k for a 2nd hand tambo it has fully depreciated. You should be able to sell it in a couple of years for close to 100% of purchase.
if you pay $6k for a chinese one then it depreciates so that it is worth maybe 60% of purchase.
That sounds great in theory.... But in reality...., please point me in the direction of the 2nd hand Aussie made hardfloor camper with, stove/sink, fridge slides, toolbox, water tank etc for $14k.
They don't exist, maybe, if you are really lucky you could get a 2nd hand one for $24k.
So in my case and in my opinion, it wasn't a poor financial choice.
Anyway, have a hug back and :cheers:.
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Most of these comments seem to be pointed toward the low end of the market ( which is fair enough, because that's the majority ) but the other end seems to be going as strong as ever !!
KK make hundreds of campers a year ( and sell them ), as do AS, AORC etc..
But as with any big company running big wages and production costs, a wheel only has to fall off at the wrong time and all of a sudden, they're in big trouble..
I can't for the life of me work out why in this economic climate you would think of starting a camper manufacturing company....but some are still trying....and some are falling by the wayside trying ??
I know of at least one company that is still going strong......doesn't advertise....builds almost only to order.....almost a one man band...why ?? maybe little overheads and no bank looking over his shoulder ??
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When talking import vs export fir Australia it doesn't cost the same. It is relative to the value of the aus$ Our dollar has been high making exports too expensive and imports even cheaper. Something else to blame on Kevin Rudd
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can't for the life of me work out why in this economic climate you would think of starting a camper manufacturing company....but some are still trying....and some are falling by the wayside trying ??
Couldn't agree more. Specially with some huge players that have been around 10-20 years falling apart like a house of lego.
I know of at least one company that is still going strong......doesn't advertise....builds almost only to order.....almost a one man band...why ?? maybe little overheads and no bank looking over his shoulder ??
Rent for your factory, advertising and gas/water/electric are also a massive killers.. How much is enough space for 1 campertrailer at Sandown/Caulfield/Rosehill shows cost... let alone for 5-10 trailers!!!!
I don't think some people really plan well.. its like for a while every kid with a 30ft lifted hilux thought they could open a custom accessory 4b shop
You can only fit so many bent giveway signs as bullbars to mates before you run out of customers and giveway signs :D
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it is a poor financial choice to purchase a new poor quality chinese one compared to a 2nd hand quality oz one for a simple reason;
if you pay $6k for a 2nd hand tambo it has fully depreciated. You should be able to sell it in a couple of years for close to 100% of purchase.
if you pay $6k for a chinese one then it depreciates so that it is worth maybe 60% of purchase.
This is not snobbery but common sense. Like my prado. I bought it 2nd hand after depreciation for 50% of new value. Could have bought a brand new Great Wall x220 for the same value. But, once again, an inferior product ready to depreciate like crap.
But hey, do whatever you like in our wonderful sweet free country.
Have a hug in the meantime :cheers:
the savings upfront on the higher spec and/or brand new cheap imported product offsets the depreciation loss in the future.
in other words - you buy cheap and accept a much lower resale value commensurately - that's the trade off for the instant upfront cost savings you have achieved.
in many cases, buying a great wall 4x4 is the only option for many to actually buy a brand new 4wd vehicle they will ever have.
and whilst you 'should' be able to onsell your locally produced 2nd hand CT in a couple of years for about the same price, I suspect these days that is very rare as the market is flooded with thousands of CT's for sale at cheap prices.
it's only a poor financial choice if you buy something cheap thinking you will re-sell it for only a small loss, or will easily re-sell it in any market (ie it is desirable) - if you buy cheapo and expect to keep it long enough to satisfy your outlay (and it does everything you need it to), then its a great financial choice - is it not?
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That sounds great in theory.... But in reality...., please point me in the direction of the 2nd hand Aussie made hardfloor camper with, stove/sink, fridge slides, toolbox, water tank etc for $14k.
They don't exist, maybe, if you are really lucky you could get a 2nd hand one for $24k.
So in my case and in my opinion, it wasn't a poor financial choice.
Anyway, have a hug back and :cheers:.
If you took the time to read what I initially said then you would realise that I was comparing apples with apples. A cheap $6k trailer with THE ONE ON THIS SITE.
The point I was making was that if that quality trailer is not selling, and newbys ask what they should get, and still dont get that one then there is something going on.
I was not attacking your personal choice. Nor did I attack your 'Australianess'.
Mercy!
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it's only a poor financial choice if you buy something cheap thinking you will re-sell it for only a small loss, or will easily re-sell it in any market (ie it is desirable) - if you buy cheapo and expect to keep it long enough to satisfy your outlay (and it does everything you need it to), then its a great financial choice - is it not?
No its still a poor financial choice. You have just justified the purchase to yourself of a new one over a second hand one.
I cop flak for bagging out the chinese choice and am happy to cop it. The reality is that across the entire manufacturing industry we have embraced cheap and new over quality and it kills our industry. Its not the only reason but a big one.
The point, in this discussion, is that if a quality Aussie CT does not sell, despite people being pointed towards it, shows there is an issue. Its not to reignite the whole debate..
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Like any business you need to change and adapt to the market. Sadly a lot didn't and closed. You cannot keep selling the same style and keep increasing the prices and sell the product.
As mentioned the expensive brands of camper are selling but the sub $15k and $10k range has a lot of competition. If the market is too competitive you need to look at designing and market a style that will attract the buyers.
Sadly a lot of manufactures are not clever marketers. That's their downfall.
Regarding resale value. That does not concern me. I buy a product to use and enjoy. If I had to sell I accept what some one is willing to pay on the day. I own the product, the product does not own me.
Mark
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That sounds great in theory.... But in reality...., please point me in the direction of the 2nd hand Aussie made hardfloor camper with, stove/sink, fridge slides, toolbox, water tank etc for $14k
I reckon you could get this down to under 14k
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=33722.0 (http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=33722.0)
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I reckon you could get this down to under 14k
http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=33722.0 (http://www.myswag.org/index.php?topic=33722.0)
Yep, I reckon you could but its a soft top isn't it?
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Touché ;D ;D
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No its still a poor financial choice. You have just justified the purchase to yourself of a new one over a second hand one.
I cop flak for bagging out the chinese choice and am happy to cop it. The reality is that across the entire manufacturing industry we have embraced cheap and new over quality and it kills our industry. Its not the only reason but a big one.
The point, in this discussion, is that if a quality Aussie CT does not sell, despite people being pointed towards it, shows there is an issue. Its not to reignite the whole debate..
As opposed to justifying buying a 6/7 year old aussie CT or imported Prado etc just because its not Chinese?
I can buy a brand new Great Wall diesel 4x4 auto with sunroof for less than half a brand new Prado base model, or about the same as a 8 odd yr old prado with over 100ks on the clock.
I bought a second hand X5 a couple years back, and when I went to sell it, no one was interested until I dropped the price well below what I thought it was worth. It took me a year of listing it for me to drop the price to a selling point that soemeone was interested.
That's my point - if something isn't selling, it's not value for money in the eyes of prospective buyers.
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ITS NOT BECAUSE ITS CHINESE!
The conversation is about aussie CT places closing down.
I suggest its because of all the imports flooding the market and people buying them instead of quality used Aussie ones.
And in my opinion - it makes more sense to buy a used QUALITY unit for $6k than a new similar less quality import. And BMW depreciate like crap - Toyota does not. Simple.
Dont forget to post how much you sell the Great Wall at sales time. You did buy it, surely?
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Like any business you need to change and adapt to the market. Sadly a lot didn't and closed. You cannot keep selling the same style and keep increasing the prices and sell the product.
As mentioned the expensive brands of camper are selling but the sub $15k and $10k range has a lot of competition. If the market is too competitive you need to look at designing and market a style that will attract the buyers.
Sadly a lot of manufactures are not clever marketers. That's their downfall.
The higher priced market should be watching over there shoulder too.
The Chinese manufactures have healthy market share of the lower price market, there now chasing the higher priced market.
Its going to be interesting to see if the new Chinese manufactured off road vans such as those from MDC will have much of an impact on the Australian manufactured ones from AOC ect. Maybe not straight away but eventually they will. Very sad indeed.
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As mentioned the expensive brands of camper are selling
They are selling, but I'm betting not at the same #s they were 3 years ago now that theres so many Lucky Dung hardfloors showing up
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Look at the latest 4x4 mag. There is a test on the Patriot camper. Looks like a X Trail right down to the army star and color.
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ITS NOT BECAUSE ITS CHINESE!
The conversation is about aussie CT places closing down.
I suggest its because of all the imports flooding the market and people buying them instead of quality used Aussie ones.
And in my opinion - it makes more sense to buy a used QUALITY unit for $6k than a new similar less quality import. And BMW depreciate like crap - Toyota does not. Simple.
Dont forget to post how much you sell the Great Wall at sales time. You did buy it, surely?
No need to shout.
I feel we'll qualified to have an opinion on your comment, as I have been researching my first CT purchase for 4mths. Now, I have a budget and a list of requirements like everyone.
We aren't all dummies rushing to buy any old Chinese tripe that is offered to the market. After lots and lots of research, I'm definitely buying an Aussie 2nd hand camper, as i think i would be able to sell it quicker if required, and it all i can afford (as we may not end up loving camping enough to justify it sitting in the garage).
But you're missing the point, perhaps purposely? If I buy a Great Wall, I accept that it's a cheap car with poor resale, but I have saved all that lost resale value upfront. Same with the CT.
I bought the Prado, because I could afford to and I wanted it, but for significantly less outlay I could still do everything I wanted to with the Great Wall. But if I tried to sell the prado in 5yrs with over 100ks on the clock for near what I bought it, it's not going to sell is it?
Just to blow your value comment out of the water, a new prado grande costs about 90k?? I got a 3yr old with 60ks for 50. So, a 40k loss for the original owner. Ouch.
Great Wall at 30k - are you suggesting I would need to pay someone at least 10k to take the car off me if I sold in 3yrs?????? (Jokes aside of course!!)
Whilst it has to be true that imported CTs have impacted the local market, imported everything has impacted every Aussie manufacturing market. People buy what they perceive is value for money, and many people obviously aren't seeing the value in locally made CTs. And just like me, many people don't see the value in a brand new aussie CT, and whilst still have the option of brand new Chinese, will still go for 2nd hand Aussie, but its a close call....
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[quote author=Mik01 link=topic=34675.msg551937#msg551937 date=1389954485
Just to blow your value comment out of the water, a new prado grande costs about 90k?? I got a 3yr old with 60ks for 50. So, a 40k loss for the original owner. Ouch.
Great Wall at 30k - are you suggesting I would need to pay someone at least 10k to take the car off me if I sold in 3yrs??????
[/quote]
I traded a 3.5yr old Prado 2010 TD GXL 150 the has been sold by the dealer for 13 less than I paid for it brand new. Less than 4k per year is pretty cheap motoring for a 60k car IMO.
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Just to blow your value comment out of the water, a new prado grande costs about 90k?? I got a 3yr old with 60ks for 50. So, a 40k loss for the original owner. Ouch.
Just to blow you value comment out of the water, I doubt anybody pays RRP
I paid 55 for mine, 60+ list, it's worth 45 now, not bad for a 5 year old Prado...
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No need to shout.
Whilst it has to be true that imported CTs have impacted the local market, imported everything has impacted every Aussie manufacturing market. People buy what they perceive is value for money, and many people obviously aren't seeing the value in locally made CTs. And just like me, many people don't see the value in a brand new aussie CT, and whilst still have the option of brand new Chinese, will still go for 2nd hand Aussie, but its a close call....
Phew. Finally you get what I was referring to. Apologies for yelling but that was the only way I could get you to understand.
Glad we could agree.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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This country IMO is rooted. We are no longer a proud country looking out for our fellow Aussie's, we've mostly become the Smith's or Jones's with the majority hell bent on having everything new, latest and greatest and for as little as possibly outlay or effort. This is multiplied largely by the huge ses pit of multiculturalism that refuse to assimilate and think being an Aussie is to run around waving a Chinese made Aussie flag on Australia day while chowing down on imported groceries. How many of those over payed "IMO" holden workers mentioned earlier drive holdens ? Not to mention a stupid government that's handed over good money after bad to them without even acquiring a discounted fleet in return.
Go to Germany and have a look in the VW or BMW car park, I bet it's better than 80% full of cars the workers have produced. I use this as an example as someone mentioned the similarities between the counties.
Aussie business should also be a little prouder, looking to support other fellow Aussie's in manufacturing and supply not just becoming middle men passing on imported crap marked up while leasing a Prado or 200series to negate paying "some" tax. IMO as a country we should only be buying things from OS that can't be built or built to the same standards here and the government of this great land should be doing something to bolster this.
"AUSTRALIA" no longer the proud country. Now the, i want it, and I want it now country.
Just like credit. Buy now and the country pay's later, Australia's becoming a consumption whore. Buy it, use it and throw it away and saying it was good value.
With aussie day just around the corner, do the country/your kids future a favor. Be proud to pay too much and buy something truly Australian, if you can find something other than some fruit, veg or meat. lol
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we've mostly become the Smith's or Jones's
Smiths in your case ;D
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I blame 4wd action. The amount of rubbish chinese stuff they advertise kills me. I know its a money game but stump up for the aussie companies would they for once. lol. I couldnt afford a chinese or aussie made camper so bought an aussie made trailer to start with instead. The days for local manufacturing in aus are numbered. Be prepared for the throw it away age now as the chinese stuff iis so cheap why bother fixing it buy a new one.
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I blame 4wd action. The amount of rubbish chinese stuff they advertise kills me. I know its a money game but stump up for the aussie companies would they for once. lol. I couldnt afford a chinese or aussie made camper so bought an aussie made trailer to start with instead. The days for local manufacturing in aus are numbered. Be prepared for the throw it away age now as the chinese stuff iis so cheap why bother fixing it buy a new one.
They use to flog either ARB, then flog TJM.
Then the owner of EMG got greedy, and pissed off a lot of local sponsors and started flogging imported crap, to prove, you don't need to spend big money to go bush.
But the way they flog it now, "you can't tow unless you have a chip and zorst from Roo", to drive at night, you must have at least 3 x 24 inch Led light bard from Roo Systems. You will also have to fit an aftermarket suspension from Raw. Then if you want to keep your beer cold, you must use the new Waceo CFX range, because some dill on the beach said so.
I got burnt by them buying a camper they use to flog (no names due to their legal advisors) and it was the biggest POS ever to hit the road.
They are nothing more than a cash grab selling crap, reusing stories and photos.
My mate attended one of their camper trailer tag alongs. They chose 5 trucks with couples, families and singles. Each truck got to tow a camper from different manufacturers over a 10 day period from Fraser Island to Yapoon.
They have used his Patrol in all sorts of adverts, photo,s and everything in between. That was over 4 years ago. No permission from the owner. Just re-run the same photos.
Christ, they even used a photo of my car to endorse a Bridgstone tyre, great, but mine is fitted with Mickey Thompson tyres.
Unfortunately, we no longer have access to any decent 4wd, camping, touring magazines anymore.
I now buy the US imported modified 4wd magazines if I need something to read.
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Bang on the money Dazzler, thats why we bought a second hand CUB. Hasn't let us down & its done some rough offroad trips, which is what we bought it for. I wouldn't want to travel worrying about something breaking on the trailer all the time. We saw two people with chinese import trailers get damage coming out of the exit of the creek at Gunshot (They came down through slingshot) in September this year.not especially rough/difficult either. They said the trailers were cheap & they expected problems, I told them what we paid for our second hand CUB & they were suprised. We saw them again in Bamaga & the trailers were damaged further, they had to wait in Bamaga for repairs, & take extra spares for the trip back down the Dev road. I cant see any enjoyment in that situation, especially when you've got kids.
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But the way they flog it now, "you can't tow unless you have a chip and zorst from Roo", to drive at night, you must have at least 3 x 24 inch Led light bard from Roo Systems.
They own Roo systems and Tigerz now... thus why that is the best Shit on the planet.
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It's got nothing to do with 4wd action or multiculturalism(big stretch of a bow ever to randomly rant) it's a global economy now. Australia was traditionally isolated by distance giving us a very sheltered supply and demand economy. Now with an easily accessed global marketplace the old norms are out the window
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The more everyone is educated about the garbage we are being flooded with, the better. Its simply disgraceful. You get what you pay for, shop around wisely.
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Phew. Finally you get what I was referring to. Apologies for yelling but that was the only way I could get you to understand.
Glad we could agree.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sure mate. Sarcasm doesn't become you.
But if you want to be a smart arse about it, I can play too.
I can tell from your response you realise what an arse you are making of yourself by trashing imported products and not understanding the simple process of depreciation. Particularly when you have a Jap car sitting in the garage.
New Aussie CTs just aren't value for money, as evidenced by the many manufacturers going out of business. That's because consumers can get the same or similar for less. If its not china, it would be from elsewhere.
Good luck to you.
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Just to blow you value comment out of the water, I doubt anybody pays RRP
I paid 55 for mine, 60+ list, it's worth 45 now, not bad for a 5 year old Prado...
Ummm, so he might have paid 85k??? What's your point? That's still 35k loss. My point is still well and truly proven.
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[quote author=Mik01 link=topic=34675.msg551937#msg551937 date=1389954485
Just to blow your value comment out of the water, a new prado grande costs about 90k?? I got a 3yr old with 60ks for 50. So, a 40k loss for the original owner. Ouch.
Great Wall at 30k - are you suggesting I would need to pay someone at least 10k to take the car off me if I sold in 3yrs??????
I traded a 3.5yr old Prado 2010 TD GXL 150 the has been sold by the dealer for 13 less than I paid for it brand new. Less than 4k per year is pretty cheap motoring for a 60k car IMO.
You traded it for 13 less, or the dealer on-sold it for 13 less?? Big difference
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Ummm, so he might have paid 85k??? What's your point? That's still 35k loss. My point is still well and truly proven.
Try around 80, yes that's still 30 loss on paper, however if that's a business lease you can write that off on tax so no big deal. Your point isn't proven...
Edit - I just realised you have a 120 Grande, they were never 90 new, around 78, you could get them high 60s new, so a 20 loss.
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The vast majority of new Prado's sold are sold for business purposes.
I lease my cars. No point not to. The depreciation, servicing, fuel etc and interest cost are tax deductible and I can claim a substantial tax deduction for use in doing business.
But with every single Prado I have owned I have had to pay CGT because they actually get traded at a fair bit more than total cost.
I'd rather spend $100 or so dollars a week and drive a Prado than even stand in close proximity to a Great Wall ( to keep the rabbits out)
Yep and both imports but one is a piece of Shit.....like my old MDC trailer and one is not.
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Play nice people, just about had enough of this tit for tat BS considering its been done before, your all on notice
GG
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Play nice people, just about had enough of this tit for tat BS considering its been done before, your all on notice
GG
Apologies. I will behave myself.
(I have been an argumentative little bugger of late......)
Sent from a mental ward somewhere.
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This country IMO is rooted. We are no longer a proud country looking out for our fellow Aussie's, we've mostly become the Smith's or Jones's with the majority hell bent on having everything new, latest and greatest and for as little as possibly outlay or effort. This is multiplied largely by the huge ses pit of multiculturalism that refuse to assimilate and think being an Aussie is to run around waving a Chinese made Aussie flag on Australia day while chowing down on imported groceries. How many of those over payed "IMO" holden workers mentioned earlier drive holdens ? Not to mention a stupid government that's handed over good money after bad to them without even acquiring a discounted fleet in return.
Go to Germany and have a look in the VW or BMW car park, I bet it's better than 80% full of cars the workers have produced. I use this as an example as someone mentioned the similarities between the counties.
Aussie business should also be a little prouder, looking to support other fellow Aussie's in manufacturing and supply not just becoming middle men passing on imported crap marked up while leasing a Prado or 200series to negate paying "some" tax. IMO as a country we should only be buying things from OS that can't be built or built to the same standards here and the government of this great land should be doing something to bolster this.
"AUSTRALIA" no longer the proud country. Now the, i want it, and I want it now country.
Just like credit. Buy now and the country pay's later, Australia's becoming a consumption whore. Buy it, use it and throw it away and saying it was good value.
With aussie day just around the corner, do the country/your kids future a favor. Be proud to pay too much and buy something truly Australian, if you can find something other than some fruit, veg or meat. lol
And there it is... :cup:
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It's got nothing to do with 4wd action or multiculturalism(big stretch of a bow ever to randomly rant) it's a global economy now. Australia was traditionally isolated by distance giving us a very sheltered supply and demand economy. Now with an easily accessed global marketplace the old norms are out the window
Exactly. Economists have been talking about the 'global supply chain' for years. Australia just needs to adapt to this lack of shelter and find it's place in the global supply chain (i.e., materials and minerals, services, design and engineering) and in doing so still try to have an economy that is as robust and diversified as can be.
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Perhaps I'm over simplifying it a bit...but wouldn't raising the cost for manufacturer's to import their wares help to stimulate our industries?
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Hi All,
I took a bit of interest in the initial topic as to X-trail having to close their door after many years, and noticed that the Tambo that i have for sale seems to be a bit of a topic of discussion on and off in this thread. I don't wont to enter the Aus Vs Import discussion but I thought i would give you a quick little bit of feed back as to what i believe is making the sale of our trailer a little difficult based on people that are ringing me and the questions/responses they are giving me. 1st is as mentioned many a time, why buy my second hand trailer for $7500 when you can buy a brand new trailer with a 18ft tent, full annex, kitchen....etc for the same money. I would like to think build quality and quality of material R&d, etc.... 2nd is the company Ezytrail selling 2 campers one call a Tambo and the other a Cooper and are within 10 mins of "Tambo" so people looking at my campers within the same area. This is causing confusion and people are thinking that they are one in the same, when they are obviously completely different.
I can see that chinese campers are always going to be around, and for a lot of people they will be more than adequet and $$$ is most important, but for others they will have no end of troubles (And maybe put off campers for good). It seems to be very hit and miss and the imports, and if you have the skills and time it seems to possible to bring them up to an expectable level.
We have reduce the price to pretty much give away price to compete with the imports, but i won't give it away and I'm more than happy to just wait for the right buyer now.
Thanks for your time guys,
Cam
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IMO as a country we should only be buying things from OS that can't be built or built to the same standards here and the government of this great land should be doing something to bolster this.
if only it was that simple.
Buy some Aussie made clothing or 4wd... Jeans, etc. There just isn't much manufacturing left here. What there is left here, is very expensive.. but all this has been done 2309458230984203498023948029348029348023948230948 times on this forum.
Mate of mine did a trade as a cobbler out of school in the 1980. I doubt its even a trade anymore. Much like panel beating, which has become remove/replace with cheap imported panels etc etc