MySwag.org The Off-road Camper Trailer Forum
General => General Discussion => Topic started by: hairymick on February 11, 2013, 04:39:17 PM
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Been researching hard floors for a while now and came across this one from Market Direct.
http://www.marketdirectcampertrailers.com.au/products/camper-trailer-models/expedition-series-crusader-ff (http://www.marketdirectcampertrailers.com.au/products/camper-trailer-models/expedition-series-crusader-ff)
At 20k, I think it might tick a lot of boxes.
I did a search here on market Direct but the only thread i could find is a year old.
What do you fine people think?
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Can't view all the pics here at work but looks like a Modcon copy to me.
http://modcon.com.au/campers?camper=6 (http://modcon.com.au/campers?camper=6)
KB
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Do ya homework, check 'em out and then and only then, make an informed decision.
Where on the fraser coast are you?
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Whats the canvas rated ?
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Knock off of a Modcon for sure.
I think I would spend the extra $12k and get one that I knew was built to last and will hold its value. Unlike a chinese built camper. They devalue like a Great Wall 4WD.
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For 20k I think i would be looking at better quality canvas. Im pretty sure MDC started out as an ebay seller selling chinese campers and are now brick and motor store selling the imports, I may be wrong. Is it similar to this. http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/675486035/High_quality_camper_trailer_with_Australia.html (http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/675486035/High_quality_camper_trailer_with_Australia.html)
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I can't comment on the MDC trailers as I haven't had any experience with them, but I can vouch for the quality of the Modcon Campers. If you are after this style of camper take the time to see Kerry and Phyllis at Modcon you will be really impressed with their product and their customer service.
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Whats the canvas rated ?
cheap as possible
I think I would spend the extra $12k and get one that I knew was built to last
An extra $12,000 to some people might be another 4 years of saving.
I'd buy something second hand.
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Whats the canvas rated ?
interesting option....go to the link and scroll all the way to the bottom.
"The tent in this camper trailer package is also available as an option in Australian Dynaproofed Outback Rugged Canvas manufactured by Wax Converters."
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Had a look at the first 360° camera shots and the jockey wheel is already looking sus, got a big lean on it.
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What's up with all the hatchet job comments that seem to be permeating this forum of late.
If anyone would like to contribute to this thread based on experience with MDC I'm sure there would be a few members who would like to hear your opinions based on something a little bit more substantial than giving your opinion of a picture of a wonky jockey wheel.
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I'm just saying it as I see it, Did I do a hatchet job on it? The proof is there to see.
I have been to check out MDC campers and walked away non plussed. They build to a price I guess and it shows.
My point is that if the jockey wheel is wonky on their showroom exhibit then how is their quality control for the rest of their product.
The OP did ask for our opinions if you looked and I answered.
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G'day guys,
Thanks for all the replies. :D I really do appreciate all your input and you have certainly given me some food for thought.
Currently we own an Austrack Soft Floor jobby. As i understand it, the trailer is Made Locally and fitted with a Chinese tent. We haven't been able to fault either the trailer or the tent and are very happy with the CT.
We are both rapidly heading towards 60 however and the time will come unfortunately, when the tent is just too heavy to lift onto the trailer and the climbing a ladder to get into and out of bed is also a worry.
My heart says go with an Aussie camper but as someone has said the extra 12k is hard to justify. We are not wealthy and 12k is a lot of money to us. I am sure Modcon build a brilliant camper but I have to ask is it a 12k better camper?
I think the Modcon knock off might be well worth a look :D
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I'm just saying it as I see it, Did I do a hatchet job on it? The proof is there to see.
I have been to check out MDC campers and walked away non plussed. They build to a price I guess and it shows.
My point is that if the jockey wheel is wonky on their showroom exhibit then how is their quality control for the rest of their product.
The OP did ask for our opinions if you looked and I answered.
You gave an opinion of an entire product based on a photo of a wonky jockey wheel manufactured by a third party. Hardly informative.
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get one that I knew was built to last and will hold its value. Unlike a chinese built camper. They devalue like a Great Wall 4WD.
I have a 2 year old Australian made camper, with Australian Canvas, it has dropped 10k in value in 2 years. Hindsight tells me If I'm going to write off 15% per year in deflation, then it would occur on the cheapest product to start with.
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You gave an opinion of an entire product based on a photo of a wonky jockey wheel manufactured by a third party. Hardly informative.
I did not give an opinion of their entire product. I gave an opinion on the jockey wheel they have on their example on their web site. Big difference. The OP asked for opinions so I gave one. My CT has a similar jockey wheel which is now stuffed and my CT has a tare 300Kg's less than this one. Will it last?, I know mine hasn't. It may be made by a 3rd party but they have decided to use that style of Jockey wheel on their CT. Good decision? Time will tell.
Sheesh, get a life.
Let's agree to disagree.
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Whatever
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I apologise to hairymick for the direction your thread has taken.
My take on MDC is that they fill a very valid section of the market. True they may not be as tough or as well made as some other makes but it not to say they don't do as they are designed to do. They also do not cost as much which has been pointed out already. I was looking at them seriously when I was in the market to buy but ended up buying second hand and am very happy with my purchase.
They have improved heaps since when I first looked at their products and are getting people out there camping which is the main aim.
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cheap as possible
An extra $12,000 to some people might be another 4 years of saving.
I'd buy something second hand.
Yep $12k is a lot extra - sorry no its not isn't that a weeks wages for your average politician?
But the old adage of "penny wise pound foolish" comes to mind. I would not throw my $20k at a cheaply built chinese unit when a bit more saving or debt/pain would see me in a better aussie made unit.
I would agree that unless you can afford to jump to the real deal brand new you would be far wiser spending your $20k on a good aussie made used unit.
I would think that if you search a while you can find a KK, Aussie Swag or the like in a HF for that sort of $$. There are bargains to be had if you are not in a mad rush.
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I like the concept, very small footprint which is very appealing, opens up alot of campsites .
Build quality can only be determined by seeing one, but I'd imagine you would still be infront with repairs/mods than paying the extra 12k.
Second hand is no guarantee either of fault free CT and you have no recourse if that goes pear shaped.
I reckon buy it so you can then report back to us :D
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I think that they give people another choice in campers. I have seen one in the tin so to speak, and I thought overall they looked pretty good. Didn't appear much/obvious Wrong with it. The canvas is definitely Of the better Chinese quality.
Would I buy a MDC? Yes, seriously considered one for awhile as they seem the best in that class.
Would I buy an MDC for 20k? No, I think that they are good if wanting to start out in camping and don't have tens of thou to spend. Yes it creates a smaller footprint, but a rear fold cub, kk, swag etc don't take that much. For 20k you really could buy a great camper that is proven.
Allot of MD campers are proven and they have seemed to fix problems with newer models.
so I would probably wait until they have "sorted the bugs" so to speak.
Having said that, they look great and practical. If it suits your budget, lifestyle and what you expect out of a camper for you, then GO for it. ;D
Just remember, like anything you buy go over it to ensure you are getting what you handed your hard earned cash for.
Cheers
Evo
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Just remember, like anything you buy go over it to ensure you are getting what you handed your hard earned cash for.
Good Advice Evo.
Easy way to compare what you are getting is to visit some "other" campers and see what you get from them for the money. Take notes on all and make your decision based on facts rather than the excitement of having a camper (which I know is hard).
Don't just look at the canvas or the features ... look at the bones of the structure (hinges / welds / etc) ... you will want something with good bones.
Kit_e
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Do ya homework, check 'em out and then and only then, make an informed decision.
Where on the fraser coast are you?
Mate, Sorry for the tardy reply. I am at Hervey Bay.
Guys, I spoke to the bloke from MDC Brisbane today. He answered all of my questions. I can upgrad to wax converters canvas for an extra 2k and to an innerspring mattress for the workbench for an extra $200. This sounds pretty reasonable to me.
I had another look ad the modcon range and a modcon with all the fruit that the mdc has as standard is closer to 50k, i reckon.
I am a boily by trade so will have a fair idea of what i am looking at when i climb underneath it.
At arond 22k with quality canvas and 100 x 50 RHS with 4mm wall thickness chassis and crossmembers througjout, I think the basics could be there for a very robust camper. I will have a better idea when i crawl underneath it.
Thanks again for all the replies.
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Let us know how you go mate, it sounds tops.
Cheers
Evo
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$20K [and less] will get you a very good 2nd hand late model Cub camper. These have the boat winch style opening and closing mechanism. On their web site a 6/8/10 year old girl is opening and closing the camper [no offense to young girls ;D]. The advertising blurb places a lot of emphasis on how easy it is to open for elderly or slightly less able people.
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I have a 2 year old Australian made camper, with Australian Canvas, it has dropped 10k in value in 2 years. Hindsight tells me If I'm going to write off 15% per year in deflation, then it would occur on the cheapest product to start with.
This is very surprising. I have heard of people selling their campers for more than they paid, but i seem to recall they were already 2nd or 3rd hand which may change the equation somewhat.
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We dont all know now what we will know in 2 or 3 years about our CT requirements . When l started l had been swagging & tenting for years around the country . Then saw a soft floor , looked for months , cost conpaired , designed compaired , & thought .
The short story is went soft floor on my designed trailer wedded with a sutable tent top , a very servicable unit . This forward opener is a very handy looking unit & is on the list to chgeck out on the weekend at Albury's Camping show . Where you start in the journey in CT's & where that can lead as a natural progresion . We are mostly not still driving our 1st car . So if it floats your boat go for it :cheers:
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Consider this - Don't know if you can get to see one in QLD but at the price even with a few essential welds and mods
will be well under your budget .... http://www.pinnaclecampers.com.au/product/555/OFF_ROAD_HARD_FLOOR_CAMPER_TRAILER (http://www.pinnaclecampers.com.au/product/555/OFF_ROAD_HARD_FLOOR_CAMPER_TRAILER)
I have one and am very pleased with it even though it had several bad flaws I am still way in front of most hard floor camper trailer prices ... And the ripstop canvas has survived a couple of torrential thunderstorms and kept us dry ..
Mandrake
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Hairymick, a lot is said about the advantages of Aust canvas when compared to imported canvas. I have Aussie canvas and am pleased I made that choice but there are two small disadvantages. The Aussie canvas is heavy. We have a 15oz tent roof and walls and 15oz annex and annex walls. The ripstop is lighter and easier to manage. The other drawback is it takes up more space and doesn't pack down as tight. Small things I know but you mentioned your concern with weight and ease of use. I have a couple of mates with imported tents and they are very happy. With the forward fold design you are considering these may not be real issues for you.
Just another thing to consider, the forward fold CTs (or at least the Modcons do) have a lot of weight on the towball. Just check the towball weight of the CT and confirm your tow vehicle can handle it.
Good luck
KB
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I am a boily by trade so will have a fair idea of what i am looking at when i climb underneath it.
At arond 22k with quality canvas and 100 x 50 RHS with 4mm wall thickness chassis and crossmembers througjout, I think the basics could be there for a very robust camper. I will have a better idea when i crawl underneath it.
I think you're just the right guy to give many other people an opinion of them once you have a look around/under one!
FWIW, (and I'm not saying I necessarily agree with it) the salesman's pitch when I was looking at them (must have been just before they releawsed the forward folds) was "Just because it's Chinese made doesn't mean bad quality. If they manufacture a higher volume of them compared to Australian manufacturers per year, then they should be well practised and that should mean good quality"
Having said that, he also told me that their trailers are all Australian made and only the tents were imported? But I think they possibly try to pass off "assembed" as "manufactured".
In my opinion, they're definitely competitive at their price point but it's the important things that go unnoticed by some that will make the difference. Eg we were looking at their Gal extreme and the hot dipped gal coating looked thin enough to rub off with your fingers.
Cheers!
Jono.
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Looks pretty good.
If the bearings/hubs are chinese at the very least factor in a new set of Jap or Aus bearings/seals and dust cap as the chinese stuff is rubbish.
Have fun and good luck.
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Its been bugging me, I know ive seen then somewhere but not 20k, still looking.
Mick heres a bit of bargaining power for you, found another reseller ;D
http://www.swagcampertrailers.com.au/camper-trailers/the-voyager-ii (http://www.swagcampertrailers.com.au/camper-trailers/the-voyager-ii)
Looking at the pictures on mdc I would be checking that copper pipe going into the gal, not sure gal and copper play well together.
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Hairymick, a lot is said about the advantages of Aust canvas when compared to imported canvas. I have Aussie canvas and am pleased I made that choice but there are two small disadvantages. The Aussie canvas is heavy. We have a 15oz tent roof and walls and 15oz annex and annex walls. The ripstop is lighter and easier to manage. The other drawback is it takes up more space and doesn't pack down as tight. Small things I know but you mentioned your concern with weight and ease of use. I have a couple of mates with imported tents and they are very happy. With the forward fold design you are considering these may not be real issues for you.
Just another thing to consider, the forward fold CTs (or at least the Modcons do) have a lot of weight on the towball. Just check the towball weight of the CT and confirm your tow vehicle can handle it.
Good luck
KB
I'm sure you can buy lighter weight Aus. made canvas. If you have the tent made I'd have thought you could spec up whatever weight canvas you'd like, 10 oz. walls with 12 oz. roof for example.
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I'm sure you can buy lighter weight Aus. made canvas. If you have the tent made I'd have thought you could spec up whatever weight canvas you'd like, 10 oz. walls with 12 oz. roof fro example.
You are indeed correct boxhead. I know a couple of manufacturers who use that combination. And whilst it is lighter than my 15oz all over job, it is still heavier than the imported ripstop canvas.
KB
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They seem to have a few trailers with a design that just seems a little too familiar. I did look at their campers when I was looking to buy but decided that while they were a good price for the product (that is without having seen the quality) I just couldn't bring myself to buy a product that 'borrowed' its design from another manufacturer.
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Mate, Sorry for the tardy reply. I am at Hervey Bay.
Guys, I spoke to the bloke from MDC Brisbane today. He answered all of my questions. I can upgrad to wax converters canvas for an extra 2k and to an innerspring mattress for the workbench for an extra $200. This sounds pretty reasonable to me.
I had another look ad the modcon range and a modcon with all the fruit that the mdc has as standard is closer to 50k, i reckon.
I am a boily by trade so will have a fair idea of what i am looking at when i climb underneath it.
At arond 22k with quality canvas and 100 x 50 RHS with 4mm wall thickness chassis and crossmembers througjout, I think the basics could be there for a very robust camper. I will have a better idea when i crawl underneath it.
Thanks again for all the replies.
There's been a lot said but, in the end you only have to satisfy 1 person [plus SWMBO]. If you are happy with it and it suits your needs, go for it.
Yes I do have a Modcon & yes I am happy with it, but when I got mine, it was the only one around.
Good luck if you choose to buy it & I hope to see you out on the tracks sometime.
Regards
Hem
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They seem to have a few trailers with a design that just seems a little too familiar. I did look at their campers when I was looking to buy but decided that while they were a good price for the product (that is without having seen the quality)I just couldn't bring myself to buy a product that 'borrowed' its design from another manufacturer.
But almost every manufacturer out there borrows something from other manufacturers, be it camper trailers, cars, motorcycles etc.
One manufacturer comes up with something unusual and then the next year a few others have a variance on the same idea.
Bill
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You're spot on Bill. Just have to look at mobile phone design and the patent wars going on with them.
KB
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My comment relates to Chinese steel.
Having experiance in metal fabrication and welding, beware of Chinese steel it that's what the CT is made from. The reason - Chinese steel is not manufactured to the same standard as we're used to in Australia.
When welding for instance, a nice seam of weld will turn into a blown hole without changing any welder settings because Chinese steel has inconsistent tolerance across it's section which you cannot see with the naked eye. There's a reason it's cheaper.
As far as their campers go, I won't comment as I haven't looked at them 1st hand
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They seem to have a few trailers with a design that just seems a little too familiar. I did look at their campers when I was looking to buy but decided that while they were a good price for the product (that is without having seen the quality) I just couldn't bring myself to buy a product that 'borrowed' its design from another manufacturer.
Lodi I think your right, I've noticed with this particular camper model, along with a number of other Chinese imports, there seem to be a number of different companies selling the same trailer, but each company just gives the trailer a different name, and maybe the trailer is a different colour. The post from Campingwithkids seems to confirm this, it sounds like he sells the same trailer.
Not that there is anything wrong with this, or it means your getting a bad trailer, it just makes me wonder what's going on with the imports from China when you have a number of different Ozzi companies selling the same trailer. You don't see that with Ozzi companies doing the same thing, for example there is only one company that sells the Aussie Swag Ultra D, no one else makes the same Trackabout models, and so on. Maybe someone can enlighten me how it works?
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There is a company here in Adelaide shipping these hard floors in in large quantities and then on-selling them. He may not be the only one, there may be others that I'm not aware of.
They come into the country with no canvas or running gear, tool boxes, axle etc, then they are on-sold to others who add their own finishing touches.
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The Chinese are very good at "borrowing" designs and copying them - they don't seem to have the same copyright laws that we have here -
Sometimes they actually make a good quality copy !!
Its a bit like the advert for "Genuine Imitation Rolex watches"
Mandrake
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There you go, I thought I'd seen it somewhere.
Camper Trailer Wholesales (http://www.campertrailerwholesales.com/Products.html)
Look at the 'Products' page
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For 20k I think i would be looking at better quality canvas. Im pretty sure MDC started out as an ebay seller selling chinese campers and are now brick and motor store selling the imports, I may be wrong. Is it similar to this. http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/675486035/High_quality_camper_trailer_with_Australia.html (http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/675486035/High_quality_camper_trailer_with_Australia.html)
$5200 per unit ex china seems like a pretty good deal... It's a long way from $22k though!
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G'day guys,
After much research and even more soul searching, we have decided to part with a few more dollars and look for a very good, second hand Kimberley or similar..
Thank you all for your well thought replies. You have probably saved us from making a costly mistake
:cup: