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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Heiny on November 26, 2011, 12:21:33 PM
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The better half and I are going to an information workshop this Monday night presented by Housing Investments Australia (HIA), we have been told that we may meet the requirements for up to 48% of our income tax per annum to be paid direectly into our mortgage or into an investment property :-\
http://www.housinginvestments.com.au/ (http://www.housinginvestments.com.au/)
The workshop is conducted by Mr Michael Browne who is apparently one of the most sought after educators and speakers. ???
The leter that confirms our seat reservation states that the workshop is a presentation of general information only, we will not be asked to to purchase anything (such as books, CD's or DVD's) nor will we be asked to spend any money on additional courses.
We will recieve a $50 Coles/Myer voucher on the night just for attending.
Has anyone attended one of these workshops or heard of this company, sounds all to good to be true ???
:cheers: bubba
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sounds all to good to be true ???
Does smell a little fishy, a good accountant will be able to set you up with negative gearing no problem. With the real estate market in the crapper caveat emptor.
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I have been looking at their website and it verymuch property investments orientated, so I'm not sure how this will help me, because unfortunately we have no investment properties.
It may not be dodgey, but I can't see it being of benefit to our circumstances.
But I guess I'll now more after the workshop.
:cheers: bubba
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I have been looking at their website and it verymuch property investments orientated, so I'm not sure how this will help me, because unfortunately we have no investment properties.
It may not be dodgey, but I can't see it being of benefit to our circumstances.
But I guess I'll now more after the workshop.
:cheers: bubba
You have no investment properties ??
That's the aim of the seminar......to convince you that you need one. !!!
If you are 100% convinced you don't want one....don't go.....
If you are thinking whether you should.....then go......I'm sure they will convince you. !! ;D
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I have been looking at their website and it verymuch property investments orientated, so I'm not sure how this will help me, because unfortunately we have no investment properties.
It may not be dodgey, but I can't see it being of benefit to our circumstances.
But I guess I'll now more after the workshop.
:cheers: bubba
It's free to attend, But I'd put money they try to sign you up to a property they have or know about. I would guess that's how they make their money. Not fishy but may have a faint smell about it.
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Haven't actually heard of this guy or seminar......but generally these seminars are more about selling investment properties from a specific development.That's not to say its a bad investment and if you go there with the object of gaining information only you cant go wrong.Watch for warning signs of hard core selling and before you make any decisions ask the seller how many properties in the particular development they own.
Property investment can be achieved by literally anyone and are a great way to plan for your financial future.Just keep an eye out for the SHARKS, and remember the golden rule " IF IT SOUNDS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT USUALLY IS " GOOD LUCK :cheers:
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Sounds like you are going with your eyes open and a bit of scepticism, probably the best way to go. If they are dodgy, it is the gullible people they end up stinging
:cheers:
Dave
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Bubba,
Go along, listen, get your voucher, and come home without committing to anything, and then take some time to stew over anything that sounds good to you.
They seem like a one stop shop (based in Qld) and give the impression they build to sell to you, and even can provide the finance for you.
If you are considering buying an investment property, especially your first, make it in your own state, close to where you live, know the area, and can keep an eye on it, but do your research on a property first.
I'd be keen to hear what they have to say so report back. Also if you have any questions relating to property investing feel free to PM me and I'll help you in anyway I can.
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Bubba
As Jkohn says be very careful with these seminars. Look, listen and learn do not sign anything. Working in the cairns real estate market I can tell you some horror stories where investors were convinced to buy property and lost hundreds of thousands of dollars. I sold a unit for $ 198,000 recently and the poor interstate investor paid $560,000 3 years ago.
As Jkohn mentioned pm us and we can advise. No one can predict the market, the next growth area, rental returns etc... It's guess work as we are still feeling the effects of the gfc. There are too many factors involved in to create the perfect market.
Mark
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Bubba
I have had people ringing me about something similar to this.
Yes i was iterested then i talked to the Accountant.
As others have said keep your eyes open and don't sign anything on the night.
Most importantly run it all past your accountant.
Cheers Brian
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73Bubba,
Generally they will be praising the tax advantages of owning an investment property. By doing this the will be using specific investment types, my bet is that they will be trying to sell 3 and 4 bedroom homes and townhouses in new and probably fringe estates. These types of seminars are being heavily targeted at the mining fraternity presently due to the high income. Generally the real estate is rubbish and won't value up anywhere near the advertised market price.
If you are even contemplating considering the product they are offering please phone a real estate agent or three local to where they are trying to sell the product and talk to them about the real value, rents and vacancy rates.
All to often these guys use a few exceptional real life examples and tout this as being an everyday occurrence.
If you are thinking about buying an investment property, you are better off upgrading your own property and buying a better quality house or unit for yourselves to live in, and using the 6 year rule as an opportunity to sell your current home, which you can rent out in the mean time, and claim tax benefits and then sell it capital gains tax free. Talk to your accountant and solicitor before proceeding on any situation when your investing this much of your hard earned in this type of economy.
I have an example of this style of marketing. I once valued a unit at Alexandra Headland 3 times in one month for $160K. Spruikers tried to sell it in Melbourne for $290K, Sydney $275K and in Brissy at $245K. This is known as two tiered marketing and heavily frowned upon in the industry.
Cheers
PB
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I sold a unit for $ 198,000 recently and the poor interstate investor paid $560,000 3 years ago.
(http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd234/cremo1/Smileys/shock.gif)(http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd234/cremo1/Smileys/shock.gif)(http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd234/cremo1/Smileys/shock.gif)(http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd234/cremo1/Smileys/shock.gif)
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And don't be too disappointed if your free voucher is only good if you proceed to sign up. 8)
Old story nuffin 4 nuffin.
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We will recieve a $50 Coles/Myer voucher on the night just for attending.
Has anyone attended one of these workshops or heard of this company, sounds all to good to be true
Decent seminars with prominent speakers don't need to offer incentives for people to attend. I've gone to my share of "free" seminars in the past with the promise of something free at the end. Sure, they came through with the freebie, but there always seemed to be a catch, such as being pressured to buy something, asking for your details so they can contact you later, or in one case, having to sit through a session reading sections out of the bible!
It will be interesting to hear your feedback if you end up attending.
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Bubba
I was in similar situation 5 years ago went to a seminar and then they ring you up after and invite you in one on one. They took me out to houses that have build ready for renting. You also speak to one of their financial people to set up the negative gearing.
I asked if I could use members equity bank and they said no then I asked them to break down the costs of building house and land as I found it was a bit over priced and i said I could build one cheaper than they could. They agreed to do this but after the phone call I never heard from them again.
So basically I used them to get an idea what was out there and were the growth suburbs are.
I bought a block of land in one the areas they were building in and put a house on it and I finished it off for $30,000 cheaper than were selling them for.
I still have it today.
If you have any questions just pm me
Doug
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This mob appears to be trying to trade off the HIA (Housing Industry Australia) Image.
They are just a selling front for their partner company GR8 Homes.
http://www.gr8homes.com.au/index.html (http://www.gr8homes.com.au/index.html)
I could find no reference to GR8 homes in the Housing Investments website, which is deceptive.
Typical SEQ white shoe brigade, avoid like the plague.
There is no easy way to invest. You must educate yourself, do lots of research, get good advice, build a plan and this takes time and effort.
Making money from property is about knowledge not luck.
Cheers
Parry
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I attend a lot of these things. I get a lot of free accommodation and restaurants vouchers. I have never had to sign up for anything just attend. There is a little box on the pamphlets they give you to fill out just make sure you read the pamphlet because you may get annoyed for life ;D. There are some shams out there but if you set your own rules and talk to your accountant before doing anything you will do OK.
Finding a good accountant that gives investment advice based on Australian tax laws is a hard thing to find. If you accountant is just doing your tax and not telling you how to invest your tax dollar then it is time to change.
A few rules we run by:
Buy your homes under 5 years old in a fast growing area. Do you research on local council development approvals for the previous 2 to 3 years and what has is on the agenda for the next 5. Plan to sell after 5 years and then do it again. If you make any money on the property invest it back into your own house and not the investment. After all your home is your castle and you are best to owe the least on your own property in case you end up in financial difficulty. Don't get attached to the rental as you are only using it as a tool to save you some tax money. Only purchase the house in the name of the person who makes has the highest income.
I have learnt all of the above by mistake. I haven't lost any money but it has been tough on the finances at times and I could have made more than I did. I am looking to sell a property I own at the moment and I look to make around $60k after CGT because I did my homework.
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We have no intention of buying anything through these people, they just called out of the blue and started raving about how much tax we could get back. I know things don't come that easy and that's how we have come to be where we are in life, by being very careful and making smart and informed decisions our properties have all made very good returns.
So far our success has only been with the properties where we have lived, but we do hope to aquire some local investment properties in the future when we consider the time is right for us.
We have a very good accountant who does provide advice on investments, we also have a very good financial adviser from whom we take options back to the accountant so that we are able to make informed decisions when investing our money.
I am now thinking that we may not even attend this workshop, because I know that we will gain nothing from it.
Thanks everyone for your input :cup:
:cheers: bubba
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Don't discount new factories as an investment either. A little bit cheaper, less maintenance cost, but businesses do go bust which could leave you without a tenant.
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but businesses do go bust which could leave you without a tenant.
There are a few of those in SA at the moment and there will be more before the state of the economy improves ::)
:cheers: bubba
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Good time to buy then, you see the cash come out now from the smart investors...
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Good time to buy then, you see the cash come out now from the smart investors...
That's if you have the cash to spend at the moment :-\
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go there, dont be afraid to ask questions.
give them false contact info unless you like what they say, and sign nothing - you have nothin to lose if they cannot contact you or if you sign nothing. not even the attendance book.
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most of us have two eyes, two ears and one mouth and provided we look and listen twice as much as we talk we can all learn something,
go along look and listen and learn something, and treat all info with caution
cheers
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There is a hot option invest with SCAM P/L . Thats right your chance to invest in my extencive , expencive life style . So you get ripped off but by a really nice guy not Some Creep After Money P/L ( SCAM P/L ) Send any spare $$$$ to my bottle shop account quickly , Thanks
Really if you have to ask then its something you should ask yourself . Am l Feeling Lucky ???. It might work for you when it hasnt for other . If you cant walk past it each day then the house is to far away from you 8)
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they just called out of the blue
This is where I hang up.
go there, dont be afraid to ask questions.
I suggest don't bother at all, the $50 voucher is gotcha, you turn up and they get to work on you. Don't worry they will have all the right answers for you and want you to sign on the spot so you do not miss out.
We cop this all the time in Port Macquarie, spruikers on the street handing out free scratchies - and surprising when I have grabbed on they all win a prize BUT all you have to do is attend a seminar to get your prize. Of course the fine print states that you are in a draw for a prize.
Now they want all your contact details before you attend.
It is a rort and a scam. Don't waste your time
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My experinece with one of these type of things was for time share apartments. My wife and I only went for the free gift, which I can't even remember what it was but didn't get it, and they could see I was not gullible for their scheme. My wife show the tiniest bit of interest so they tried to split us up figuring they would have some success with me out of the picture.
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This is almost how we got our investment property.
After some hiccups when building, we are very happy now.
I did read some great ideas in this topic, keep them coming.
The best thing is it is reducing your tax and when selling you hopefully will make some profit. Which you can use to reduce your own mortgage.
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I have attatched a property clock that may help some investors on this forum.
Mark
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I would agree with that generally. I would probably put the Gold Coast and Tweed in the same categories of Cairns and Sunny Coast. That will start to move again now the Commonwealth Games is going to be held there. I was having a beer with the principals of RW Gold Coast last week and they reckon there seeing increasing sales volumes.
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Hey Bubba my 2 cents
• Properties through these seminars are are usually overpriced, don't believe what they say up front.
• Do your own price check of the area first
• Anyone who says do it just for the tax breaks without making it clear of the other risks – run a mile, investing is about making a profit first, tax breaks second
• Investing in property is more risky than people would have you believe, it’s not set and forget and you need to be very involved in the investment and the market to be sure you are on the right track.
Negative gearing works like this:
• You have purchased an investment where the expenses are higher than the income it brings in.
• So let's say that the annual income is $15,000 and the expenses are $20,000,
• Makes you out of pocket for $5,000 in the year (approx $100 per week)
• The $5,000 is claimable as a loss in your tax return and you get Some, Not All of the 5 grand back in your tax refund, depending on your tax rate
• So every year that you are negatively geared, regardless of the tax break, you are still out of pocket because your investment is making a loss. Especially if the investment loan is “interest only”, because you are not paying off the loan, just maintaining it.
When do you make a profit from a negatively geared investment?
You can only make a profit in 2 ways,
1. if the income eventually becomes higher than the expenses, or,
2. when you sell.
• If your loan is “interest only” For the income to to be higher than the expenses, you need higher rental income, or reduced costs. Will that happen? Not in the short term and maybe not even in the long term as history has shown.
• If you are paying off the investment on a Principal & Interest (P&I) loan then at some point you will be positively geared and making money, you can start to recoup the loss from the early years.
• Selling – to make money on the sale, let’s say in 10 years, then you need to make enough profit to cover the losses from each year of ownership (so that’s abut $50,000) plus the costs of starting up the investment (stamp duty, loan costs, legal fees) plus the disposal costs (agents fees, bank fees, legal fees) plus 50% capital gains tax and phew fingers crossed we don’t have another GFC in the meantime!
Cheers!
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When your rental income is more then te costs aren't you paying tax over it?
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Hey Bubba my 2 cents
• Properties through these seminars are are usually overpriced, don't believe what they say up front.
• Do your own price check of the area first
• Anyone who says do it just for the tax breaks without making it clear of the other risks – run a mile, investing is about making a profit first, tax breaks second
• Investing in property is more risky than people would have you believe, it’s not set and forget and you need to be very involved in the investment and the market to be sure you are on the right track.
Negative gearing works like this:
• You have purchased an investment where the expenses are higher than the income it brings in.
• So let's say that the annual income is $15,000 and the expenses are $20,000,
• Makes you out of pocket for $5,000 in the year (approx $100 per week)
• The $5,000 is claimable as a loss in your tax return and you get Some, Not All of the 5 grand back in your tax refund, depending on your tax rate
• So every year that you are negatively geared, regardless of the tax break, you are still out of pocket because your investment is making a loss. Especially if the investment loan is “interest only”, because you are not paying off the loan, just maintaining it.
When do you make a profit from a negatively geared investment?
You can only make a profit in 2 ways,
1. if the income eventually becomes higher than the expenses, or,
2. when you sell.
• If your loan is “interest only” For the income to to be higher than the expenses, you need higher rental income, or reduced costs. Will that happen? Not in the short term and maybe not even in the long term as history has shown.
• If you are paying off the investment on a Principal & Interest (P&I) loan then at some point you will be positively geared and making money, you can start to recoup the loss from the early years.
• Selling – to make money on the sale, let’s say in 10 years, then you need to make enough profit to cover the losses from each year of ownership (so that’s abut $50,000) plus the costs of starting up the investment (stamp duty, loan costs, legal fees) plus the disposal costs (agents fees, bank fees, legal fees) plus 50% capital gains tax and phew fingers crossed we don’t have another GFC in the meantime!
Cheers!
That has to be the best explanation of it, I've ever heard.
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Well summarised Mallory. It is a case of eyes wide open and even then, one cannot control the economic factors. Just lately, I have considered using a buyers agent to purchase a property. That way I reckon I've got half a chance of not getting ripped off and also not having to deal with selling agents.
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Mallory well written.
Like any investment its the holding costs you have to consider. Currently units in Cairns have had Body Corp insurance policies go up in some places 500%.
I deal with alot of sellers who have lost a considerable amount of money some up to $400,000 on investments where the market has dropped but they did buy off the plan at exorborant prices. This happens mostly on units.
Houses are alot safer but if buying in a new estate especially a large estate, there will always be new homes built that will be in competition to a 3 year old home in the same estate. No one can predict the market and as an agent we have to try and guess the next 3 to 6 months as sellers want exact answers. At the end of the day always talk to an accountant and not a financial adviser that tries to sell you an investment. I have seen too many people get ripped off from them.
Always think that if things went pear shaped and you had to sell make sure you do not borrow over the top.
Mark
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...and not a financial adviser that tries to sell you an investment. I have seen too many people get ripped off from them.
Mark
So what does an agent do that's different?
LJ
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So what does an agent do that's different?
LJ
LJ
I will clarify. An honest agent markets a property and will let a buyer make a decision on whether that property suits their needs. In the negotiation stages the agent is there to get the best possible price for the seller. A buyer can always say no as can the seller but we always try and reach a comprimise between both parties.
A financial adviser is there to advise a client. I have seen many buyers being told to buy property from dishonest ones with over inflated values and returns. In fact I recently sold a unit for $255,000 and the seller paid $530,000 2 years ago. That financial adviser was tracked down by the federal police in WA for misleading.
Do not get me wrong not all finacial advisers are like that as now they have to disclose what commissions they receive when they sell or advise you about a property. And yes there are also dishonest real estate agents.
Mark
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And yes there are also dishonest real estate agents
x eleventyteen
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Why not invest in CTs & Grog , then watch the market belly out then invest in the glut of properties on the market . As the world turns to sh1t :laugh:
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If the deal was any good, they wouldn't need to pay you (in accom, vouchers, meals etc) just to come and hear about it would they?
Oh and Mallory great explanation.
Cant help but be reminded of a mate, who took up a similar offer, that involved a flight to brisbane, a long drive to the 'estate', and a very hard sell. Followed a not so subtle threat to leave him and his wife out there. It was only when he dialed 000 that they took them back!
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That has to be the best explanation of it, I've ever heard.
X2 well done Mallory :cup:
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I have attatched a property clock that may help some investors on this forum.
Mark
Dont tell me about Cairns
Bought 2008 for $289k. Now worth $245k
Body corporate 2008 = $2k pa
Now = $7.5k pa thanks to Yasi and all that Shit
At least it is rented
grrrrrrr
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Well when I got home from work the better half had decided that we were not going to the info workshop and I didn't take much convincing, because on the way home I noticed a 4x4 in the local car yard, so we went down to have a look and now I'm waiting to hear from the salesman on what he will gives for her car as a trade in ;D
:cheers: bubba
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Changing in plans hey? :-)
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Why not invest in CTs & Grog , then watch the market belly out then invest in the glut of properties on the market . As the world turns to sh1t :laugh:
I have. And now I'm waiting..
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Once we had decided that we wouldn't be going I tried to call HIA on the number that was on the letter of confirmation of our seats to advise that shouldn't be expecting us. Well suprise suprise, I was advised to please check the number before dialing again as this number is not connected ::)
Very happy that we didn't go >:D
bubba